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what is this I don't even

The Two Most Inexplicable Examples of Video Game Community Harassment This Week


Lets catch up with the hazards of being a woman in the gaming (in this case the indie gaming) industry.

Zoe Quinn is the creator of Depression Quest, a text based game that seeks to present the experience of someone suffering from untreated extreme depression. She recently put the game up on Steam Greenlight, a system introduced by Valve for its Steam service, that helps indie developers show that their games have enough of a following to deserve integration into the Steam Store and platform, something that can really increase the visibility of the project. Then she took it down after a wave of misogynist harassment that appears to have been levied simply because she was a woman attempting to talk about depression, though she has also tweeted that at least some of it stems from an idea that she is a “pill pusher” even though medication is only one of the ways in which the player can choose to cope with the in game character’s illness.

Regardless of the initial kernel of disagreement, the form the anti-Depression Quest outrage took was itself deeply misogynistic, and familiar to anyone who follows stories of internet harassment campaigns. Individuals shared around Quinn’s contact information, including her home address and telephone number, in order to send rape threats, misogynistic slurs, and even to call her up and masturbate into the phone. Because, as we all know, women don’t suffer from depression because “they can just go out into the street, [spoiler cut for explicit sexual description] lie down with their hole open and have any man come solve all their problems.”

Since this round of harassment, Quinn has returned Depression Quest to Steam Greenlight, so you can go take a look and vote for it if it’s something you think is worthy of putting up on Steam. You can also find a review of it here.

Let us turn now to Mighty No. 9, a Kickstarted spiritual successor to the Mega Man franchise, that even has Mega Man creator Keiji Inafune involved. This week the makers of the game introduced their backer community to the game’s newly hired community manager, Dina Abou Karam, as one of the Mighty Numbers, just like all of their backers, with some fan art she’d done of a female version of the game’s titular main character Beck, the Mighty No. 9. This may seem obvious to you, but it will become important in a moment: the update was clear that this “female Beck” was simply fan art, or, as might be implied from the framing, Karam drawing herself as Beck.

Some members of the Mighty No. 9 backer community took this to mean that Dina was a corrupting feminist influence on the game, delved into her personal life, and demanded that she be fired and that they be given refunds. From Gameranx:

Finding fault with her presentation, these persons decided to pry into Dina’s personal life by combing through her Twitter account for other transgressions against the human race, and found that she had written tweets supportive of feminism and linked to one of Anita Sarkeesian’s videos. In a similar case, her being initially hired as a community manager and artist became tantamount to BioWare’s employment of Jennifer Hepler as a writer for the Dragon Age games—sometimes dubbed as the “cancer that is killing BioWare.”

Kickstarter does not, in the vast majority of cases, allow refunds: the company’s policy is that you’re choosing to trust the project creators with your money, so once you’ve handed it over, their participation is over. However, as a recent rash of “kicktrolling” has shown, it is fairly easy (or at least doable) to get your credit card company to reverse the charge, even after you have received backer rewards.

Without access to the backer forums, it’s unclear how numerous Karam’s detractors are, but Comcept, the game studio behind Mighty No. 9, felt forced to make a statement in response to accusations that she  holds “biased views towards social justice in favor of women and transgendered LBGT community members,” that since being hired she has altered or will alter significantly the content of the game to follow a “feminist” agenda, and that she slept her way into the job because her boyfriend also works at Comcept. Naturally no such parallel investigation was made to see if there were other qualified Comcept employees had a friendship with another employee before being hired.

Comcept actually sat down and responded to questions like: “Will the community manager be creating their own robots and levels and programming, or changing the game in any way, from what the core creative team wants?!” The answer, of course, is no, because that’s not what a community manager does, and were they to try they would probably eventually be fired for annoying the dev and concept teams.

In my title I call each of these examples of harassment “inexplicable,” even though they have clear explanations: some folks are uncomfortable with a woman making video games. Some folks are uncomfortable with a perceived feminist being involved in their video games. But “inexplicable” was really my first reaction: you mean a bit of gender swapped fan art led to backers demanding that heads roll and money be refunded? That an interactive fiction game placed on Steam Greenlight would incite an internet community that apparently believes that because they have the attention of men, women can never suffer from depression?

The emotional toll of harassment campaigns on their survivors should not be dismissed, diminished, or undersold, and I am glad that Zoe Quinn is continuing to promote Depression Quest on Steam and that Comcept has stood by Dina Abou Karam. Listen, vocal sexist minority of the gaming community. If you think you come off looking like the “not-scared” members of this community, you need to step back and take a look at the larger picture.

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  • Tanner Austin

    This kind of behavior makes me want to not even associate with the gaming community. Most gamers I know don’t act like this, but it’s the ones that do who seem to make the biggest impact.

  • http://www.according2robyn.blogspot.com/ According2Robyn

    I don’t even know how to react to crap like this anymore, except to let out an exasperated sigh that lasts three hours.

  • Jason Rye

    Sometimes I really think we need to follow the Jay and Silent Bob approach dealing with these kinds of a-holes, get their addresses and “make” them apologize.

  • Philip Lopez

    Days like this I HATE being associated with gamers. This kind of attitude and reaction is childish and is what is keeping video games from becoming more than simple distraction.

  • Curtis Owings

    What a bunch of a-holes.

  • Lilian Bobadilla

    These are the days when I believe anonymity on the internet should be eliminated and that acting like a criminal online should be treated the same way as in real life.
    My other approach paying them in kind, by releasing their information and asking for their heads, jobs, etc. see how they like it.
    That will really cut down the bullying on the net.

  • Jen Roberts

    This is exactly why we should continue associating with the gaming community, and encouraging all gamers of all stripes to speak up, so people *don’t* think all gamers are like these pocketwhackers.

  • Important Film Maker

    This is why I never want to be thought of as part of the “nerd” or “geek” community; unlike the fuzzy- wuzzy image of nerds created by sitcoms and comic books, the real thing is usually hateful and afraid of anything new.

  • Anonymous

    What the hell is wrong with such a large part of humanity!? To think behaviour like this is acceptable or even ‘normal’?
    Honestly, If we were a decent society we’d track down these deranged individuals and put them in intensive therapy and cognitive behaviour modification until they learn to express their opinions in a manner that doesn’t belong in an asylum for the criminally insane.
    Steam should really look into this more.

  • Herbert West

    TBH, what I got from the Dina case was that a lot of people got angry that she got the job out of nowhere because she was friends with people on the team, that her artwork is of questionable quality, that her views are likely to influence the development of the game which wasn’t supposed to be about any agenda in the first place (believe it or not, some games can be just about FUN) – one of her first suggestions being that the main character should all of a sudden be a girl instead of a guy, and that she has had questionable arguments on Twitter not just with harassers, but simply with people questioning her choices (not her gender, sex, or even pro. qualifications – simply her opinions and choices), locking down her Twitter account, then re-opening it and deleting some of her more critiqued posts and pretending they never existed.

  • http://www.widdershinscomic.com/ Kate A

    Who cares how good her art is, she’s not being hired as a concept artist. And talking about the place of women in games does not mean that any project you’re attached to suddenly gains an ‘agenda’.

    Believe it or not, some games can have women on the staff and be FUN :)

  • Anonymous

    I don’t think eye for an eye will solve the problem, but I’m all for more stringent requirements for creating online accounts, as well as treating (legally speaking) online bullying/criminal threats as exactly what they are.

  • Herbert West

    I don’t care about the sex of the people making the game. Nor did most of the people. Did you read my comment? Dina is a known, outspoken supporter of feminism and LGBT issues. Which is fine. But some people, who have read her views and argued with her about them in the past, were afraid that she was going to politicize a game that didn’t have any agenda. And indeed, there were indications and comments from Dina herself that the main character should be a girl, not a guy. This was seen as validation of their fears to some people. And they got pissed. Also, that she’s not being hired as a concept artist has little to do with the case in question, because some people asked if she was going to have any input in the making of the game, and until this blew over all the internet and forced Comcept to come out and post about it, nobody got clear answers to their questions – probably because Dina was the one supposed to answer them.

  • jrob23

    holy shit. It’s like you didn’t even read that guy’s comments. :(

  • Anonymous

    Annnnd queue, “THIS IS WHY WE CAN’T HAVE NICE THINGS!!” So sick of hearing this.

  • Anonymous

    I would like someone to investigate the background of Karam’s harassers. I’m pretty sure we’ll find a better case for their own agenda than we could find looking at hers.

  • Herbert West

    Do you also want to not associate with other humans because some of them are assholes? There will always be assholes, like it or not. The majority aren’t. You’ll find the same reality in all communities.

  • TheBoost

    People who freak and demand explanations because a woman with known feminist views is hired by a game company… THEY are the ones politicizing a game. If the merest suggestion that a videogame robot character might be possibly discussed as maybe being female “validates fears” and pisses people off, that’s a pretty solid sign those people have personal problems.

  • Herbert West

    Don’t worry. It’s ok. I don’t expect most people to look deeper into things. I’ve long ago accepted that people tend to gravitate on either extremes in any social discussion, and they’ll often dismiss whatever doesn’t immediately validate their view.

  • Herbert West

    How about they’re just being pissed because they’re sick and tired of seeing their hobby being turned into what they see as a tool for social justice and political change?

    Look at pretty much any “geek” blog these days, and it’s near impossible to find one that doesn’t take some sort of political or social stance. Even here. You can’t discuss the newest trailer for Godzilla without the conversation centering on whether or not the trailer and the movie seem to have too many white people. THAT’S politicizing. And some people are sick of it. And so, you will see reactions of all sorts by some people in an attempt to “push back” against what they perceive to be an invasion of their hobby by people more interested in a cause than things like gameplay, replayability, graphics, sound, etc. etc.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    Everything has an agenda. Mighty No. 9 already had an agenda–an agenda to make a spiritual successor to Mega-Man because many people feel that the brand is being mishandled at Capcom. So, yeah, even fun games have an “agenda.”

    That doesn’t make the harassment Dina got right, though. All she did was have an opinion, and get hired at a game company. It’s pretty telling that most of the people flipping out over it talk about the fact that she’s a FEMINIST that WANTS PLAYABLE FEMALE CHARACTERS!! first before anything else. The only legit complaint I’ve seen about her in all this is that she admitted that she wasn’t an MM fan at one point, but then implied that she was a fan at another point. Which was stupid of her to do, but hardly deserving of the witch hunt she’s gotten involved in.

  • Anonymous

    This is appalling behavior. What, truly what, motivates people to act so deplorably?!

  • Lien
  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    It’s not just “their” hobby. It’s also Dina’s hobby. When gamers threaten women for working in the industry, for being feminists, for wanting better female characters, they are TURNING IT INTO A BIGGER ISSUE because they’re calling attention to how sexist they’re behaving. If these gamers were treating women like people it wouldn’t BE an issue. It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy and I have no sympathy for male gamers that feel uncomfortable with having to talk about how women are treated when they’re just sitting back and letting people say things like “women can’t be depressed because they can have lots of sex because they’re women!”

  • http://www.thenerdybird.com/ Jill Pantozzi

    From the post, and something to remember:

    “Will the community manager be creating their own robots and levels and programming, or changing the game in any way, from what the core creative team wants?!” The answer, of course, is no, because that’s not what a community manager does, and were they to try they would probably eventually be fired for annoying the dev and concept teams.

  • Lien

    Holy… crap… you are really thinking too much about this, do you? I think i stop reading as soon as i read “Agenda” and “her views”…
    Do you realize this whole conundrum isn’t about either of that?

  • Anonymous

    On the game itself: Interesting game concept! I can see the difficulty in tackling this, and choosing this medium to reach out and make people aware of depression is bold and innovative.
    On criticizing the creator over “pushing pills”: I don’t think she’s getting any money from big pharma. If you’re going to talk about depression, medication is a big part of the theme, for good or ill, and should be discussed.
    On harassing the creator: faith in humanity currently lost.

  • Herbert West

    Yes. But they took the stand once things blew up way out of proportions. As I said below, when people asked at first, they didn’t get clear answers.

  • Herbert West

    It didn’t start out as a sexist campaign of harassment, believe it or not.

  • Lien

    So… when i see a guy harassing a women down the street, i have to tolerate him cause everyone else don’t treat women the same way as he does?
    I hate to live in your neighborhood.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    It started because she likes the idea of a female playable character being in more games, as far as I can tell. It seemed threatening to these players. Can you see why people would see that as sexist?

  • Lien

    Kinda hard when the vocal minority manage to silence or intimidate the majority on this issue…

  • Herbert West

    I can see that. Some people can’t. I’m just trying to say that the whole story wasn’t just about harassing Dina. It didn’t start out that way, and it could have been just another little kickshitter argument had the guys at Comcept spoken before things went too far.

    The way I see it, women have been part of the industry since its earliest days, and have been influential since the beginning. The larger the community becomes, the more people are involved, and of course, over time it’ll involve a more varied amount of people. So of course, you have more politically-minded games and communities these days. That’s a given.

    Some of us gamers, however, are not too keen on the community being about more than JUST the games.

  • Jen Roberts

    Yeah, it’s not an easy thing to do, I’ll admit that.

  • Jen Roberts

    I got it from True Porn Clerk Stories, from the guys who would come into the video store she worked at and try to surreptitiously jerk off with their hands in their pants pockets. It’s just such a wonderful word to SAY.

  • Herbert West

    Yes. I can see that. I can also understand (but not agree with) how some people thought the game would turn out to have a social/political agenda attached to it. And when some tried to bring the subject up (some less successfully than others, I’ll grant you that), they were turned down, and didn’t get clear responses. Which led to arguments, and flame wars, and later, harassment against Dina. Not saying that any of it is right.

  • http://www.facebook.com/nuuni.nuunani Nuuni Nuunani

    The funny thing is that someone working on something they themselves are not a big fan of is not something new or startling. Some of the better known names in literature don’t read much, the head developer of Final Fantasy’s non MMO franchise professes to dislike videogames and prefers watching movies in his spare time, and alot of people get into genres they have little interest in simply to try better understanding it.

    As for the whole twitter thing, i think someone should be confident of what they are saying beforehand voicing an opinion for if you feel the need to delete a comment to make it go away, it wont simply vanish on a place like the internet.

  • Lien

    Who CARES about how it started! Even if you are right (which nothing is being backed up but your own words), the entire issue about this, the whole reason this is being brought to light, the WHOLE reason people are being angry about it here in the comment section ARE the sexist comments and silencing campaign that is way too familiar when it comes to women online.
    You can make a 200 page essay on how the first stone was justified or whatever but you cannot defend the next 5000 stones thrown against the poor woman… and yes! I did make a horrible stoning metaphor.

  • Herbert West

    “The funny thing is that someone working on something they themselves are not a big fan of is not something new or startling.”

    Hence the #MightyConfessions on Twitter at the moment.

  • Joanna

    Yes but it doesn’t mean we should let them get away with being assholes.

  • Thomas Hayes

    Everything is political.

  • Herbert West

    I’ve got a monkey wrench here that begs to disagree.

  • Lien

    I read that statement as “I’ve long ago accepted that people who disagree with me or doesn’t understand me deserve neither of my pity nor my respect as i will call them extremist and detractors. I’m such a victim here.”

  • Joanna

    Except people did point out that she was “pushing a feminist agenda” and liked Anita Sarkeesian so…

  • Thomas Hayes

    Who made it? Was it imported? Did it come from a company that uses low-cost sweatshop labour? How much energy went into its production? How much fuel did it take to transport it from manufacture to the shop you bought it in? What are the views of the owners of the company who made it?

    Everything is political, you’re just choosing to ignore that. I’m not going to feel sorry for you if you get mildly annoyed by people asking serious questions, even if they are about the arts. Games have been political for a long time. Get used to it.

  • Herbert West

    Wow. You really putting words into people’s mouths, don’t you?

  • Herbert West

    Nobody said we should.

  • Herbert West

    Holy shit. You’ve mixed my wrench in politics it had no business being in. Now I’m going to have to teach it how to have an opinion and make its mind on the matters it’s being involved.

    Oh and I’m not annoyed at the situation. Or at people bringing one subject matter or another where *I* feel it may or may not belong. If something annoys me I’ll just switch to something that doesn’t.

  • Herbert West

    Which is what I said. Some people were rather hesitant at her inclusion in the project because of that. Others were more aggressive. Most didn’t care either way. But some were afraid it would turn the game into something else than they had imagined it would be (I guess some people out there still don’t get how Kickstarter works).

  • Dara Crawley

    But you’re assuming the number one thing our society tends to assume
    Not having an agenda…means being from a white hetero-normative male perspective. THAT is the default, and I’m sorry most women these days and most minorities reject that. When a person says someone is “pushing an agenda” by hiring a particular person with views means they don’t see that other perspectives really exist and for some people are neutral. It’s like when people complain that having a person who is gay acting as a judge is pushing an agenda by giving them a job. However straight people have no agenda because being straight is considered the default for society.

    This article in particular makes clear that she did fanart, and you like some of the people complaining are assuming that means she’s changing the gender of characters. Firstly, that shows you don’t know the scope of her job, and secondly, that’s a heck of a conclusion to jump to without reason. Then people are taking her individual opinion, that she’d like a girl lead, and are blowing it out of proportion. These people don’t understand the lack of female leads, and perhaps also like it that way. As a person of color I would prefer for their to not only be more female leads but more black leads. What do you expect? There are virtually no black lead characters, and a slightly bigger margin of female characters out there. Even the gender neutral Samus became a sexualized object when she was revealed to be female. (The amount of comments that went from “She;s a badass I want to be like” to “She’s a real hottie I want to be with” is kind of shameful). The point is no one working for this company is neutral, or lacks an agenda that we know of. She like her co-workers has a perspective and opinion. Yet somehow when it’s not the white male hetero-normative perspective it becomes an agenda.

    Plenty of people get jobs by virtue of who they know, and that doesn’t automatically mean she’s under qualified. Did she have an unfair advantage, yes. Men have been thriving off of old boys clubs for years and continue to in many ways. Regardless of gender connections get you a job. Who else for this company is being investigated for knowing someone?

  • Lien

    …or you could realize the topic about your wrench becomes out of your subject and you can safely say “I don’t know” instead of feeling attacked then making a stance while making a worst case.. Heck, you could just also just take a cup of coffee and then just listen to the guy without saying anything instead of trying to tell the man to leave. At worst, you can just leave the room.

    You make it sound that once politics is brought up and you are not part of it, you HAVE to speak up for some weird reason. No one is saying this, by arguing back the wrench is not part of political talks, you are taking part of politics talks itself.

  • Herbert West

    I’m not a victim. It’s a basic fact that people are so biased that they’ll deny or outright refuse to acknowledge opposite opinions, that even when presented with facts that differ with their idea of a situation, they’ll pull back even further into their position.

    Posts of your kind, where you like to put words into the mouths of people you disagree with, are strawmen of the highest order, btw. You might wanna check into that, because it marks you as someone that cannot be reasoned or argued with.

  • Lien

    Not part of the topic but i just always post this video when someone says “Keep your politics out of my X”.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_tdztHiyiE

  • Lien

    …so posts like yours?

  • http://www.thenerdybird.com/ Jill Pantozzi

    You’re not saying “any of it is right” but you sure are trying to defend the actions quite a bit.

  • http://www.thenerdybird.com/ Jill Pantozzi

    Just a general word to all: keep it civil, no name calling, personal attacks etc. Bannings will take place if necessary. This is your official warning.

  • Anonymous

    What you’re essentially saying though is “Geeks and gamers don’t want to grow up.” Saying you don’t want to think about things like racism, sexism, homophobia being a part of something you like is essentially saying that games are not the pastimes of adults and should be thought of as enjoyment only for children.

  • Anonymous

    It was already political, which is what he was pointing out.

  • Lilian Bobadilla

    Ohh don’t get me wrong, I know eye for an eye will never solve anything, it is just sometimes I feel that if you make an example of a couple of the bullies maybe the others will think twice before acting so. I’m not saying that is what should be done but my malevolent side just thinks it would be nice to flip the coin back on them and see how the like it. A little reverse empathy kind of deal.

  • Herbert West

    This is a long post, and a good one. I agree with it for the most part. The hetero-normative agenda does exist, however, although it’s more of a knee-jerk reaction of the established order attempting to resist change.

    Dina did fanart, yes. I did not assume that she would change the gender of the characters. She brought up the point herself in a comment, and some people took that as sign that she would attempt to push for changes to the game. Of course, it’s jumping to conclusions. Yes, it’s blowing things out of proportions. The internet is not known for its reasoned, calm, cool-headed debates. Even the class forums for various MOOCs have been exposed to ridiculous flame wars.

    I will not argue against your points concerning the lack of female leads in video games. Nobody does.

    As for why other people on the team wouldn’t be investigated, maybe that’s because the rest of the team met the expectations of most of the backers. Is that a double-standard? I guess you could say it is.

  • Herbert West

    I’m not defending the actions. I’m saying there’s more to the story than just a bunch of assholes being horrible human beings over the internet.

  • Lien

    Understood, sorry if i went too far. Something tells me i’m gonna reread the comments here tomorrow and regret typing what i did for the rest of my life.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    Dude, I’m a gamer, too. I’ve been playing games for 20 years, since I got my Game Boy as a 6-year-old. Heck, I played games at arcades and demo kiosks at stores even before that so you could say I’ve been a gamer even longer.

    The fact of the matter is, whenever you have a human being working on something–particularly something that’s creative and subjective, like a video game or a movie or the architecture of a building–they’re going to bring their own perspectives to their work. Games have never been JUST games. Even in the early, abstract days of video games, they were about something. Heck, look at Missile Command–the cities in the game are meant to represent real California cities, and the creator had nightmares about these cities being blown to bits while he was working on the game. He probably didn’t start working on the game intending to make any sort of statement about war, or sacrifice, or anything of that nature–but he still brought his own perspective into the game.

    And frankly, no matter how this mess started? It DID turn into sexist harassment. And it’s happened time and time again. Hell, I go to /v/, so I was THERE when it turned into a big broohaha and the users started bashing her and talking about how women/feminists “ruin” games. I’ve seen it happen. And 4chan is not some minority or fringe group or secret club–MILLIONS of people go to this site every day. And these people are controlling the discourse in gaming. It’s starting to feel that any time, ever, that women are mentioned in relation to gaming, it turns into this drama. Adam Sessler is offended by what he perceives as a sexist joke in a God of War game? It causes a huge blow-up on the internet. Anita dares to criticize games? She gets rape threats. (And I’m saying this as someone that DOES feel that Anita has shoddy research and DOES have a confirmation bias that gets into her work, but it doesn’t matter, IT DOESN’T EXCUSE RAPE THREATS.)

    I, frankly, don’t care how this started. This is how it ended up, and I am tired of people suggesting we ignore it. Stop defending people that do this sort of thing! If gamers speak up and fight back against the people that push for this sort of harassment then we’ll stop being defined by it. But as long as we sit back and ignore it it will NOT. GO. AWAY.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    No, there really isn’t. It doesn’t matter why they’re being assholes–they’re still being assholes. I wouldn’t care if this was about feminists harassing a guy for saying he liked to play as a male character, whatever the reason IS there’s still no excuse for harassment. None. Ever.

  • Herbert West

    Some people don’t want to grow up, no. Not just gamers and geeks, although we get a lot of bad press about that, as if it was more common about us than any other group in society.

    I’d like to see a comparative study about that, too.

  • Dara Crawley

    But how do they know? That’s the thing that bothers me personally…is they singled her out because they could. However, I have not seen anything where other people have been investigated and questioned. I dunno…even if I don’t agree with people a bit of consistency would be nice.

  • Herbert West

    I remember the early days of the video games industry too because I’m a fair bit older than you are, by the time the Game Boy came out I was done with high school. And yeah, some games were just games. And crappy ones at that. Which is partly why it crashed.

    Nice to see another citizen of /v/ on here — you know what it’s like being called a white knight whenever we try to reason with people on there.

    And no, the way it started doesn’t excuse rape threats. I never said it did.

    I will say it once again, because it bears repeating: if you’re going to report on something, why not tell the whole story? It doesn’t excuse the actions of the wrongful party (why should it?) – but it makes for better reading and gives a better understanding of the story, as well as offering lessons for the future.

  • http://www.facebook.com/nuuni.nuunani Nuuni Nuunani

    Okay, at least its not something new ^^;

  • Herbert West

    Why? I don’t agree with you, but you shouldn’t regret stating your opinion.

  • Charlie

    I don’t see what’s so wrong with the genderbent picture of Beck. It wasn’t a suggestion, just some fanart.

  • Herbert West

    Hepler herself stated more than once that she didn’t even like video games that much. She just liked writing the stories.

  • Travis

    In actually reading the comments, it appears that the major problem is that Dina has clashed with members of that community before and isn’t trusted to fairly represent their feedback to the development crew.

    Which is fair I suppose. If Bill O’Riley was chosen to be my representative, I’d probably have a similar reaction.

    I didn’t see any comments stating they didn’t like her because she was a woman. They didn’t like her, personally.

    Still going completely overboard, of course, but this isn’t a case of “ZOMG! A GRRL! NOOOOOOO!”

  • Herbert West

    There’s nothing wrong with it that I can see. I’ve done fanart of all sorts myself, I’d be a hypocrite for saying there was something wrong with hers.

  • Herbert West

    This is what I’ve tried to say, yes.

  • Charlie

    Then why is everyone getting upset about her, she just seems like a nice gamer to me. I’m a backer of Mighty No 9 I’d be disappointed if there isn’t a female character to play as somewhere in it.

  • Dehydration

    I’ve posted this once somewhere else, but feminism and her being a woman really isn’t what everyone’s mad about. Here’s a simple rundown of the events that actually did happen.

    - Around the time of the MN9 Kickstarter taking off, Dina posts fanart above, agreeing to a post that includes ‘please make Call playable, or make Beck female altogether!’. This was the first we’ve ever seen of her.
    - Some time later, an announcement in the MN9 forums come out: Dina has been appointed as Community Manager.
    - Backers are wary, since her first appearance didn’t particularly paint her in a positive light. The CM relays backer’s thoughts to Comcept, so it is pretty important. Others are fine, they think it won’t influence game design.
    - People dig into her twitter. Treasure trove right there, tweets going ‘Never an MM player’, something of ‘bf is working on the project’, and a pretty big one – ‘I got community manager AND designer!’ followed with ‘designing robots FTW’ or something of that sort.
    - Two problems. One contradiction, her first forum post claims that her favourite MM is MMX. The other is her post saying ‘AND designer’. Like it or not, her style does not match what was already shown to us.
    - Backers get worried. Neither nepotism nor inexperience were anything they put money into. Lots of questions asked in forums about these topics. No answer.
    - Some moderators try to keep things calm and explain why Dina’s A-OK. The problem is that they do this by mod editing on the question posts of the backers. People generally don’t like that.
    - Until a bit later! Dina locks her twitter. People get even more riled up. When the twitter is unlocked, all those posts go missing.
    - Dina comes up, confesses that yes, she only just started playing recently but she’s played MMX and downloaded some classics when she found out she was in the running for CM. And yes, she did know people in Comcept. Oh, but bf actually stood for best friend. Designs? That’s another project, actually.
    - People aren’t satisfied. Why the disappearing posts? Why lock twitter? How did you actually get the job? Didn’t you say ‘community manager AND designer’? How much input do you have? Are you lying?
    - Mods try to cover for her. Again, they fumble. Mod edits and warnings for ‘Slander’ abound instead of concrete answers.
    - Eventually, two backers are banned. From viewing a forum they paid money to access. For ‘trash-talking staff’.

    When Manami Matsumae (a woman) was announced as the composer of MN9, were we angry? Nope. We welcomed her with open arms since she’s a veteran and she’s pretty damn good at what she does. Now on my left we have Dina. You tell me why people shouldn’t get mad.

  • Charlie

    ‘please make Call playable, or make Beck female altogether!’ Personally don’t see what’s wrong with this. Unless you are a misogynist then you might get upset.

  • Lilian Bobadilla

    One of the things that prevent me from commenting to anything online is that for the most part people are so eager to have their opinion heard about something that they don’t really take the time to really read what they are commenting on thoroughly. Is like the equivalent of listening and hearing something (if you don’t know the difference then there is really no talking to you). While the problem with Dina may have not started out as plain harassment it turn into that, and not just harassment it turn into threats. Now if you know the logic of not bringing a gun into a knife fight it is the same thing.

    People can have dissenting ideas about everything, for every 1million people that say the sky is blue, there is going to be someone to say it is red. It is how we express our ideas and our discontent with something or other that matters, it is how we view and treat the person or person we are debating with that matters and makes all the difference.

    If you have something worthwhile to say or ask, why must it be that for you to say this you have to resort to name calling and insults and threats. And here is the infuriating part, most of these people DO NOT behave this way in real life. You DO NOT do this to someone you are talking to in person. So either we – the world as whole- are living our everyday lives with really disturbed and probably mentally ill individuals or we are just plain mean and awful people.

    What really bugs me the most when I see post like this is that undoubtedly someone in the comments is somehow going to try and rationalize the behavior, especially is the person being harass is a women. Here is the thing the same way that murder is not the answer to someone breaking your favorite toy, it is NEVER OK to treat PEOPLE (not just women, PEOPLE) that way. Just because you don’t agree with their way of life, their political stands, their opinions, it is NOT an invitation for bullying and harassment and threats. You can disagree and express your disagreement in the way that real, breathing living humans beings do, by being courteous and nice.
    Rant over. sorry for being a long comment.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    See, the problem is: what painted her in a negative light? Was just wanting to be able to play as a woman. That’s all. That’s the start of this. So, yes, it looks really freaking sexist, and makes every other complaint against her look like an excuse to cover up the original misogynist feelings toward her.

  • Vian Lawson

    Days like this I know I have to stand up and be identified as a gamer. There are many, many more of us than there are of them; most gamers are kind, reasonable people who can argue the whys and wherefores of gaming like civilised adults. The poo-flinging monkeys get a disproportionate amount of attention, but if we don’t oppose them, we are allowing them to dominate the dialogue.

  • Tony

    The phrasing of your initial post does sound like you were saying we should, just saying :)

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    Sure, and a lot of Hepler’s comments made me cringe, and I have really mixed feelings for how Anders, the character she wrote in DA2, was handled. But she was unfairly used as a scapegoat to explain why Dragon Age 2 was bad (despite the quest she worked on in Origin being popular), and people even started blaming her for stuff in Mass Effect 3, which she didn’t even work on. And even if she destroyed everything Bioware touched like some people think, it still doesn’t excuse people commenting about her weight, or throwing sexist comments at her and harassing her.

    I mean, how often is it that we’re talking about a guy involved in the industry that’s gotten these sorts of attacks? Off the top of my head I can think of Adam Sessler (who got there because he partially gave a game an average score because he took offense at what he thought was a sexist joke) and maaaaybe one of the guys behind Mass Effect 3. And even then I don’t think either of those guys got threatened with rape or harassed over the phone.

    Actually as I’m typing this I can think of one example: the Penny Arcade guys got death threats against their family during the dickwolves debacle. So, there’s one example. But there’s still a lot more examples that involve women…which is a really scary precedent.

  • http://www.facebook.com/nuuni.nuunani Nuuni Nuunani

    And there is nothing necessarily wrong with that. Miyazaki said he doesn’t like playing videogames either but he was still happy to work on games like Jade Cocoon and Ni No Kuni.
    If it was a programmer I would be very concerned (as the job is VERY reliant on enjoying games) however as she is simply a community manager, I see her interests as having very little impact to the matter of the actual game.

    When it comes to her actual position, I would be far more concerned over how she is interacting with members of the community.

  • Philip Lopez

    A solid point and one we all need to remember when we see reactions like this.

  • Charlie

    I think we should all take a moment to think about how awesome Curly Brace is in Cave Story.

  • http://www.facebook.com/nuuni.nuunani Nuuni Nuunani

    Lets see…The guy who told people that if they didn’t have an internet connection to use the X-box one with then they should just ‘deal with it’, that gamer in warcraft who became a meme for terrible gameplay, anyone who says X console sucks or X console is superior, that one developer for EA who spoke in support of the company he worked for…It would take a while to name them all but there is plenty of vitriol to go around due to over reactions on all manner of topic in both directions of virtually any subject that people get especially passionate about

  • Herbert West

    Not everyone is upset about her. But those who are do not all fall into an homogeneous group either. There are many points of dissent in this story, most having little to do with her genes. It’s a rather long story.

    Which is what I and others have been trying to point out in the comments : it’s not a simple story of “people are mean to her because she’s a woman”.

    And NO, none of it makes her any more deserving of harassment. FFS, why do I even feel the need to postface my comment with this?…

  • Herbert West

    I wanna frame your post.

  • Herbert West

    Excuse my not being native english-speaker for sometimes not getting my point across in the clearest of manners. ;)

  • Herbert West

    No. She also had a history of really bad arguments with people before. She was disliked for other reasons too.

  • ampersands

    Because you’re oversimplifying the original article in order to object to something you can object to, and people, myself included, find that derailing. No one thinks it’s as simple as “people are mean to her because she’s a woman.” You’re the one oversimplifying.

  • Dehydration

    But see, one of the stretch goals was to have Call playable in co-op mode. Call’s already a girl, yeah? That stretch goal was reached really quickly. People didn’t have a problem with playing with a girl. I won’t deny that her wanting to play as a girl did stir up stuff, but if she had posted something that looked more like MMZX’s Aile rather than what she did, something that wouldn’t have fit in at all in MN9, surely things would’ve been a little more okay. Besides, she herself said that it wouldn’t change gameplay. So why even bother when we already have playable Call?

  • Charlie

    Arguments about what?

  • Dehydration

    She was my favourite character in that game. Oh, good times.

  • Dehydration

    Call is playable. It was a stretch goal that was reached really quick.

  • Charlie

    I think maybe the whole fanart thing has been blown out of proportion. I draw a vault dweller that looks like Princess Peach a lot (ruler of the mushroom kingdom lol) but I wouldn’t expect Bethesda to start making Barbie looking player characters in Fallout games.

  • Charlie

    Yeah, I just don’t understand why this statement is so upsetting.

  • Charlie

    I don’t think those guys were threatened with rape though, Just saying. The attacks on the ladies became really gendered.

  • Dehydration

    I’m guessing that it just didn’t seem necessary since we have Call and Beck’s gender really didn’t matter?

  • Charlie

    Well no but surely that in itself should mean it’s not something to get annoyed over. It’s not really that relevant. It’s like suggesting Beck’s armour be green.

  • Dehydration

    That’s where the tweet that said she was both CM and designer comes in, and the one about designing robots ftw. Sure, she probably won’t get it approved. It may have been really a different project but who’s to say anymore?
    Either way, looking at how crazy freaked out the backer forums are, she’s not doing a great job as a CM. I just wanted to jump and shoot ;_;

  • http://www.facebook.com/nuuni.nuunani Nuuni Nuunani

    Less rape and more sodomy to death with various objects as I recall, but I honestly prefer not to give such comments more attention than they deserve. People can be so very crude at times.

  • Charlie

    I don’t know, it just seems like much ado about nothing to me. People just seem to be riling themselves up if anything. I bet the game will be awesome.

  • Dehydration

    I think all that was forgotten pretty quickly until this happened.

  • Dehydration

    I hope. For once I don’t want Kamiya to be right.

  • Lien

    I don’t recall either of the people you listed got his gender questioned by the online community or threaten to “have their kids raped as you watch helplessly” like the tweeter/e-mail hepler received. Most of the people you listed got harassed or humiliated for the reason of their action alone, Hepler got harassed for that reason and then for much much MUCH more and then some.

    With the PA crew, it was brought up as they used their own gender as justification for their acts hence the harassment campaign against them for being Straight white cis males. For Adam Sessler, it was because he hated the sexist content so people claim to know his sexual orientation better.

    I don’t ever, EVER recall guys who received the same amount of threats hepler received for any other reason then what i listed. For the numbers on the women side? It’s not anecdotes no more, it’s an entire statistic.

  • Lien

    I don’t think she was doing a bad job of being a CM if this is what the community the game developers are depending on…

  • Dehydration

    You mean?

  • Joi Owen

    There’s one prominent youtuber I no longer follow or enjoy watching because one mis-understood comment on one of his videos caused his followers to fill my inbox with hatemail. He thinks his followers make up a warm, friendly community. I know otherwise.

  • Lien

    I mean if the community was already known to be hostile against something as mundane as a fan art and then bring out a “feminist agenda” on the table beforehand, this was beyond a simple Community Manager’s failure.
    In fact, like the article points out, those guys weren’t the vast majority of the community. They were just the VERY vocal minority who were trying to bring down the ship due to their anger against a simple employee even though the misunderstanding was clarified many times by both her and the studio she was working under. If anything, a CM job should of just stop the thread before it went too far but when you are the CM and the hate campaign topic is you… How can you stop that?

  • Paragon Portraitist

    WOW. That’s disgusting! Everything in America has to be made into an ism… racism, classism, sexism. A damn shame!

  • Josh Berkus

    This sort of crap is why I gave up on online gaming 10 years ago. Still not time to go back.

  • TokenOfficeGoth

    “Some folks are uncomfortable with a woman making video games”

    Fixed it:

    “Some [jackasses] are uncomfortable with [women].”

  • TokenOfficeGoth

    Bunch of savages in this town.

  • TokenOfficeGoth

    Geeks are the new virtual jocks–just as good awful, privileged, self-entitled, bullying and misogynist I’m afraid.

  • TokenOfficeGoth

    I’m struggling to find a link for you, but apparently studies have show that anonymity has little to no effect on whether or not people act civilly. It does nothing to prevent the kind of abuse and harassment that happens–mostly because those people don’t see themselves as doing anything wrong.

    Not allowing for anonymity however, does hurt people who are reaching out who might suffer the consequences if their identities are known: closet LGBT persons, closet atheists, sufferers of abuse, depression are just a few examples off the top of my head.

  • Anonymous

    Which is… weird. Because I wouldn’t call myself a Mega Man player, but that doesn’t mean I’ve never played any Mega Man games. It’s like they’re looking for something to hate.

  • Vetinari

    Occasionally I’m reminded that I live in something of a sheltered bubble. This kind of thing is beyond inexplicable to me. I mean, I’m not an idiot, I understand misogyny is rampant and pervasive, but things like this are absurd to the point of being something you’d expect in a sketch show. And then I become acutely aware that, relatively speaking, stuff like this probably isn’t all that absurd.

  • Vetinari

    One of my favourite games of recent memory, “The Cat Lady,” also delved pretty heavily into the idea of depression, so I’m very interested to take a look at Depression Quest.

  • Vetinari

    Real nerds/geeks tend to suffer from the problematic handicap of being people, and people can be pretty awful sometimes.

  • Dehydration

    VERY vocal minority isn’t true. This is why I don’t like this article – it handwaved the most important community (the backers who pledged money) and dismissed them as that little group of misogynists.

    She didn’t take care of it well. Most of her posts were a sort of wait-and-hope-things-get-better kind of deal, containing ‘I’m listening, please tell me what’s wrong’ without much of an answer. She does actively participate in unrelated matters in the forums a lot, though. Studio didn’t actually say anything either, just mods working under her.

  • Mina

    This has been driving me nuts more recently: Most of these people are jerks in real life too, but they know better than to act like it. They know that this is not the kind of stuff you say to anyone, let alone a stranger. But you put people online and suddenly the etiquette is gone. People have a totally different set of rules for what is acceptable in real life and what is “just a joke” and “not a big deal” online. They do on the phone to some extent too. It boggles my mind how some people’s empathy is underdeveloped to the point that if they can’t actually SEE your reaction to their words, then anything they say must be fine.

  • olden

    I don’t know enough of the context to comment on depressionQuest but I can confidently say that the majority of ‘harassment’ that Dina has received for MN.9 is about her credibility concerning nepotism, not being a megaman player, not being gamer and having a feminist agenda – All confirmed by HER OWN twitter feed and internet history…

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    wait, how is her “not being a gamer” confirmed by her Twitter feed? In the same tweet where she said “I’m not an MM fan” she also said “I love 2D games.”

    Also this isn’t nepotism. She had connections but most people in the working world these days have connections. That’s how you get hired. Heck, part of the reason to go to college these days is to get connections.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    I’m not talking just about gamers flipping out, I’m talking about the direct threats–rape threats, death threats, people finding your personal information. That sort of thing. I don’t deny at ALL that men get harassed by the gaming community, too, but the Penny Arcade example was the only one I could think of where it got that intensely personal, like it often does for women in these stories.

  • Myron Byron

    “credibility concerning nepotism”

    Of course, if Dina were a man, the dudebros wouldn’t care less about nepotism.

    “having a feminist agenda”

    You know that particular dog whistle doesn’t work around here, right?

  • Herbert West

    If by very vocal minority, you mean the ones who were throwing the threats and sexist insults, then yes (and this is a problem). But the thing is, there were a lot more people with very valid questions and doubts, whose posts were edited, deleted, etc. People who did not resort to threats. people who did not insult on the basis of gender.

  • Matt Lyte

    While harassment is completely unacceptable, the concern over Ms. (Mrs.?) Karam is completely legitimate, as detailed in this pastebin. Kickstarter doesn’t do much to verify companies are legitimate before hosting their campaigns, and the controversy surrounding her leads one to wonder if they even plan to put out a product.

  • Herbert West

    This article is oversimplifying a story as well. That is what I’m reacting to. It’s not that the ‘narrative’ isn’t as true as *I* would like. It’s that the narrative is INCOMPLETE. The writer herself admits that she cannot paint a full picture of the situation for lack of access to the backer forums (even though the relevant information, screencaps of arguments, copy/paste of text, etc, have been posted all over the internet if people just bother to INVESTIGATE). To which I say: fine. But don’t write about it as if you know what happened. Like, hey, here, catch up on the situation by reading this – when the story is incomplete.

    Is it too much to ask for investigative journalism? I get that this is GEEK stuff, but do we have such low standards that we don’t actually want to know the whole story behind events before forming an opinion of them?

  • Herbert West

    Downvotes in 1… 2…

  • Herbert West

    “It’s like they’re looking for something to hate.”

    It’s like you haven’t been on the internet, ever. ;)

  • Matt Lyte

    Why might somebody downvote, Herbert?

  • Matt Lyte

    (Psst. It’s because they’re only here to feel good about themselves and don’t actually care for justice.)

  • Anonymous

    Heavy was clearly concerned, but never seemed able to nail down exactly what it was that he feared would happen.

    He struck out at Dina for being a “radical feminist,” and raised the possibility that she would somehow do something to the game.

    But that’s where it falls apart. There’s blessed little that a community manager could do to push “radical feminism” upon a side-scroller platformer. Were the game to add an option to change Beck’s gender or utilize Call more, the game would be in good company, and no change to gameplay would occur.

    For the fears to be justifiable, someone needs to demonstrate that Dina’s political views could somehow affect the gameplay. Given that her role (a role she shares) is effectively to pass on poll results to those making the game, and to keep an eye out for the possibility that many fans would want another option added to a poll (again a responsibility she shares), there simply doesn’t seem to be room in the format for anything controversial. It’s just not sensible to be worried she’d put a feminist spin on “they like the third power up” or “they think the boss music should be faster”.

  • Matt Lyte

    Did you even read the pastebin? Or the post, perhaps? This is not a child’s issue. It goes beyond the “third powerup” or the speed of the boss music. Do you even play video games?

  • Anonymous

    You don’t mean to say that there has been another instance of people looking to hate someone/thing on the internet? Consider me… startled.

  • Anonymous

    No, I did not read the pastebin. I’m an active backer, I read the post in the forums.

    As I said, Heavy failed to provide a realistic scenario in which Dina could negatively affect game design. He says a great deal aside from that, none of it having to do with anything that could affect game design, which is the only thing I’m concerned about as a backer.

  • Matt Lyte

    No I understood him just fine and I’ve only barely followed the game’s development. Not a huge mm fan, preferred X. It’s not about the game design, it’s about respecting the contributions backers make.

  • LizbethAnne

    I understand that there are probably a lot of deep issues I’m not aware of with regard to Mighty No. 9 stuff (not my area), but here’s something that’s been bugging me since I first saw it: do these dudes think that sex CURES depression?
    Because as a woman who’s in a long term relationship with a man, and who has been diagnosed as having clinical depression, by actual non-internet doctors…sperm doesn’t have magical healing properties. Having sex with a dude doesn’t help me level up in the battle with depression. THAT’S NOT HOW BIOLOGY WORKS.

  • Matt Lyte

    It is one of the pillars their hate is founded on, sadly. Being physically rejected is a terrible place to be, and it can leave you totally alone in modern society.

    Unfortunately, evolution has designed us to follow an “Us vs. Them” narrative for the sake of survival. Overcoming that is key for society to progress any further.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    Dude, even if you think that there’s a reason to suspect her, she’s not NEARLY at the head of this organization. The guy who is in charge is the CREATOR of Mega-Man. He’s worked in the industry for over two decades. And Japanese culture is really wary about this sort of thing, so he’s putting his career on the LINE for this game. There’s no way he’d produce this Kickstarter just to get money without even producing the game.

    Not to mention that at best, the most power this woman has is a chance to submit concept art. Aaaand that’s it. Anyone that thinks she could single-handedly cause the game to not come out is really overestimating her power. If the game doesn’t come out because of this, it’s not the content manager’s fault–it’s the players that claim they want to see this game come out.

  • Matt Lyte

    What are you even talking about? Explain how your comment is relevant to mine.

  • Travis

    Unfortunately, you dared stand between this site’s community and their self-righteous indignation.

    Nothing quite like watching people with persecution complexes overreact to other overreactions by other people with persecution complexes.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    You said in your comment that the controversy surrounding the community manager for Mighty No. 9 makes you wonder if they plan to put out a product at all. My comment to you was explaining why that’s ridiculous to suggest. Is there anything you need clarified?

  • Matt Lyte

    You know that what you just said about dog whistles reveals that you’re not even considering opposing viewpoints, right?

    And no, if he were a man, mm backers would care about this just as much. I don’t know about dudebros, or why you’re referencing them.

  • Jamie Jeans

    Must develop teleporter to drop rabid Canadian beavers and grouchy winter woken bears to maul these people… no sympathy for these… people… hard to describe them without using, as Spock called it, colourful metaphores.

  • Travis
  • Matt Lyte

    Straw-men, all of them. You only know that they suffer.

  • Matt Lyte

    I don’t see that in my comment, I must have edited it out, because it’s probably ridiculous.

    What’s ALSO ridiculous is ignoring the backers’ concerns over her (as detailed in the pastebin,) trying to sweep this under the rug, and generally just hiring a totally incompetent, dishonest person with the backers’ money.

  • Matt Lyte

    It’s not about the gameplay. You don’t get to decide what other people take issue with. This is in reply to Damo1234, but for some reason Disqus thinks they need to moderate his comment.

  • Travis

    Unfortunately it seems that Dina has poisoned this particular well, but thinking about it, why NOT make Beck a fem-bot?

    There’s no reason he has to be a dude. The industry could use more female characters. And god knows the game could stand to differentiate from Megaman just a little bit.

    I’d be all for it if Comcept went that direction.

  • Matt Lyte

    Just make it an option. Gender won’t affect plot, and certainly not gameplay. Sadly the controversy around her has indeed poisoned that well, I think.

  • Anonymous

    Yes, I’m aware it’s not about the gameplay.

    Hence my statement that his concern is not legitimate.

    I can’t decide what someone takes issue with, no. But I can point out that their concerns are unrelated to anything that matters from a game development point of view.

  • Matt Lyte

    And I can say I’m the Queen of England. But it doesn’t mean anything and I’m not right.

    His concern is legitimate, for a number of reasons he detailed and you somehow didn’t pick up. In short:
    -She brings nothing to the community. She was hired for nepotism, not for her qualifications. She has no PR skill, little artistic talent, and she isn’t a fan of megaman games. It’s a waste of money.
    -She’s dishonest, and disrespectful. She deleted and then locked her tweets, proving that she won’t stand behind what she says. She ignored backers who specifically addressed her, when her supposed job was COMMUNITY MANAGER.

  • Matt Lyte

    “2D games” is not a genre. Saying she loves “2D games” proves she is not a gamer. I can say I’m the queen of england, but that doesn’t make it true.

    And she didn’t network, it was nepotism. She immediately demonstrated a total lack of aptitude as community manager, yet kept her position. That demonstrates she was not hired for her qualifications as a community manager.

  • Anonymous

    There are over sixty seven thousand of us backers. Since there are no polls going on, most see no reason to participate in the forums at the moment.

  • Matt Lyte

    Your point?

  • Guest

    There are a lot of random-ass downvotes on this blog.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    Nothing you just said made any rational logical sense at all in any way whatsoever.

  • Anonymous

    Yes, were you to say you are the Queen of England, you would be incorrect. Presumably.

    But it is not incorrect to say that the community manager has no realistic way of negatively impacting gameplay. What’s she going to do, say “They voted for design E” when people voted for design F?

    The concerns about “nepotism” would be warranted were this a cushy well-paying job. It’s not. She’s a glorified moderator. It’s a terrible job with terrible pay. They needed someone that’s bilingual and lived in Osaka, and they knew someone that was bilingual and lived in Osaka. That’s not something to get worked up about. It’s a small startup company. You may as well get worked up about restaurants employing family and friends as staff.

    I’ve seen no dishonesty from her, nor disrespect. I’ve seen people taking her words out of context and disrespect aimed at her. I’m not surprised she’s greeting many posts with stunned silence, unsure of what to say. She signed up to moderate a board about a little robot that shoots things, not to justify her political beliefs to people going through her old tweets looking for things to be angry about.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    No. The backers’ “concerns” were pointless unfair misogynist nonsense based on a FANART DRAWING and a woefully ignorant misunderstanding about what her job title entails. For a company to give in to petty misogynist whining and fire a woman basically JUST for being a woman working on the game IS BAD BUSINESS. You clearly don’t understand how a good stable business model actually works, or see the ignorant misinformed misogyny in your own ridiculous argument.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    haha, what? Since when did she even say it was a genre? Some people like a 2D aesthetic. 2D also affects how a game is played–a 2D fighter usually plays differently than a 3D fighter, for example.

    And how do you know it was nepotism? People get hired to companies all the time because they know someone within the company. Unless you somehow have video tape of her interview and have read her resume and know she’s unqualified, all you’re judging that off of is her Twitter account.

    Also,this is by far not the first case of a community manager buckling under pressure during a social media crisis. I’ve worked both as a moderator for a forum for a video game (many years ago, before the job title “community manager” was even really a thing–my boss was just a member of the marketing department) and for people that do social media marketing, so I’ve seen this happen time and time again. Companies are getting better about dealing with these sorts of things but there’s still a lot of cases where they’re unprepared for it because this is a relatively new medium. A lot of people that would work in this field don’t even really have “qualifications” because, well…it’s existed for, what, ten years? Frankly some companies, even huge companies, just hire any ‘ol blogger.

    Now, do I think she’s qualified? I wouldn’t know. There’s definitely a better way she could’ve handled this at some points. But I can’t really blame her for panicking once the harassment started. And regardless of her job performance, that still doesn’t actually prove that she got the job through nepotism. You’re still tossing out an allegation where your only evidence is “she admitted she knew people that worked for the company.”

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    You are completely full of shit. Yes, we ARE saying he’s lying.

  • Matt Lyte

    Same to you ;)

  • Matt Lyte

    What were their “concerns?”

  • Matt Lyte

    Can you prove he’s lying? Moreover, who are you speaking for?
    Edit: Just so you know, this is an ongoing thing you have no knowledge of, and he is not lying, so I hope you wash your feet.

  • Herbert West

    Oh and.

    Just so you know.

    https://twitter.com/PetiteMistress/status/398277063846531073

    https://twitter.com/PetiteMistress/status/398280718972755968

    It’s not like people made it up. She did say herself that she was in the design team too.

  • Herbert West

    When the article says :

    “Comcept actually sat down and responded to questions like: “Will the community manager be creating their own robots and levels and programming, or changing the game in any way, from what the core creative team wants?!” The answer, of course, is no, because that’s not what a community manager does, and were they to try they would probably eventually be fired for annoying the dev and concept teams.”

    It’s not taking into account what Dina herself stated in several tweets. I linked to them in some comments, but here is what she said:

    https://twitter.com/PetiteMistress/status/398277063846531073
    “I am now a community manager AND designer!! BOTH!”

    https://twitter.com/PetiteMistress/status/398280718972755968
    “literally they gave me both titles! I’ll be an artist/designer on projects while managing the community aspect of the big one”

    Does she mean Comcept have smaller projects attached to MN#9 ? Who knows. But people didn’t didn’t invent her position in design at Comcept. She broadcasted it herself.

  • Herbert West

    What her job title entails?

    You mean, that she herself said was BOTH addressing the fans (mighty fine job she does at that, too), AND designing ROBOTS?

  • Herbert West

    You tell me.

  • Travis

    It’s the Internet. Irrational hating on things is the number one past time.

  • Herbert West

    Because it doesn’t go both ways, you think? Dina herself has been guilty of silencing, banning, deleting, and downright editing posts by people with differing opinions in the forums.

  • Herbert West

    I think it wasn’t interesting enough for some people to talk about this until the harassment entered on the scene. Lots of people had legitimate questions and doubts: why is a person with a history of arguing with fellow backers raised to the rank of Comm. Manager? Why does the CM say she’s designing robots? Why does this happen as people find out that she’s got close relations with some members of the team. Why were backers allowed to vote for their Mods, but not for their CM? Why is the CM silencing and deleting posts in the forums when people simply voice their opinions? And so on, and so forth.

    It’s a trainwreck and a case of “BAD PR 101″, but the video game press at large (and the geek press) didn’t talk about it until she started getting the death threats.

  • Matt Lyte

    You don’t know what you’re talking about.

  • Matt Lyte

    The community manager is the mouthpiece between the community and their backers. They don’t need to hire a person to relay a poll to them.

    If her job is to manage the community, she should be able to respond to posts. If she can’t, she is not a skilled community manager, and her hiring was nepotism. You’re throwing anyone who disagrees with your poorly informed opinion in the category of “enemy.”

    are you a nazi?

  • Peter Quill

    People are enraged at Dina because she had never played the games. It was later found out that her boyfriend and a few of his friends are on the project. Mighty No. 9 was premised as a project done completely by industry vets so I find it understandable that some new hire would cause alarms to go off. Also, when a new hire(MALE) did a Genderswapped version of the Shauntae character for her KickStarter people were also upset and made note of it to the company. No riots ensued because the person who made it was male, infact it went under the radar and you likely never heard of it.

    The Depression Quest thing is completely fake and anyone can tell by looking at the forced ‘chan’-speak.

    This looks more like yellow journalism than an informative article.

  • Matt Lyte

    My evidence for nepotism is that she’s unqualified to manage a community, has a boyfriend working on the game, and came out of nowhere to suddenly become community manager AND a designer. She didn’t “buckle under pressure,” she blatantly ignored well thought-out, civil posts, had a hard time responding to the little bit she did, and generally just did a poor job as CM. You can see http://pastebin.com/cZbZueSe for more detail.

    “Many years ago” is MANY years ago. Things advance, quickly these days. When investors become upset, companies respond. In this case, the company basically gave them the middle finger, so people want their money back. Don’t lump the civil responders in with the harassing assholes, because the civil responders are what this is all about. This blog is just trolling for clicks.

  • Lien

    ok… how is these two post relevant to the studio statement and the entire controversy? Are you trying to say she brought it up to herself or that she needed to correct herself to the people who are now still calling her names? Cause that’s kinda the vibe i am getting here.

  • Peter Quill

    Except that even before her asking to play as a woman one of the Goals to get to was a playable Online Beck and Call. Call being female. This goal was hit and surpassed in no time flat.

  • Herbert West

    They know because they backed a game that was to be made by industry vets. They know because Dina was a backer also. They know because a lot of them had arguments about sexism in video games with her, in various forums. They know because she said she bragged on Twitter that she had gotten a job of CM and designer (later on wrote a post about how her work day consisted of drawing ROBOTS for a certain game).

    Why would they single out, say, Kenji Inafune, Manami Matsumae, Naoya Tomita, or Takenori “Kimo Kimo” Kimoto?

    All of those people have worked at CAPCOM and been involved with Mega Man before since the very creation of the franchise.

    What it is that some were concerned with is that someone with no past experience in the MM franchise, or CAPCOM games, whose demonstrated art style is at odds with the game itself, and whose forum manners are less than stellar, would be appointed to a position of Community Manager at Robot Designer? That it raises questions among the backers and the fans is not surprising.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    If the civil responders allow the harassing assholes to lead the movement they’re going to be painted with that brush. Also you’re not going to do a very good job of arguing your point if you tell people that go to this website regularly that it’s “trolling for clicks.” It isn’t.

    And that’s still not “evidence.” Even if she sucks at her job it’s still an allegation that we can only speculate on.

  • http://brightblueink.net/ Inky

    Let me just check to make sure I’m understanding this right–Call’s only playable if you’re playing online co-op?

  • Herbert West

    How do you not see that it is relevant? Do I have to spell it out for you? This article says that Dina is not involved with design at Comcept. Dina herself says that she is. One of her Twitter posts is about how she spent her day at work designing robots (that’s after she started working at Comcept, mind you).

    The controversy arose because people started asking questions. Some got angry. No answers were given, and as CM, it was her job to answer the backers of the projects. She silenced some, banned others, deleted posts, locked her Twitter, then re-enabled it and deleted some of her posts. Then, some assholes took it to a whole other level and transformed a legitimate controversy about management and possible case of nepotism into something completely different.

    You desperately seem to want me to say that she deserved it, don’t you?

    Well I’ll disappoint you here.

    No. She didn’t deserve the threats. She didn’t deserve the harassment. Because you can disagree with people and be angry at them, but there’s a line you shouldn’t cross.

    For the record, I sure as all Hell don’t think she deserved the position of CM either. Or it should have been up for backers vote, like the Mods.

  • Anonymous

    On December 9th, backers were sent an email that introduced her as our new Community Manager. Not as a designer. That’s not a claim she made in the email, nor on the forums.

    Certain individuals took it upon themselves to go through her tweets and found where she informed friends that she’d been hired as community manager and was going to be a designer too. The individuals that took it upon themselves to go through her tweets spread word that she was a designer for the game. Which she’s not.

    Clarifying on the forums, she explained: “Comcept is a small and dynamic company (and somewhat of an underdog), and my passion for games and character creation means I might assist other areas of expertise from time to time. In fact, many of us here do what they can to help others in a various amount of projects! And so, my main duty is Community Manager, but, when asked to, I also contribute ideas and sketches to our amazing artists here (Komaki-san, KimoKimo-san, etc). But I am by no means a senior artist, and everything goes through them and their judgement and filter.”

    In other words she was hired as a community manager, but comcept is a small company, she’s an artist, and they indicated they might throw some work her way if they need an artist in a pinch.

    Now here’s something interesting. The people that spread that misinformation also got very worked up over a conversation she had on twitter. When a friend heard about her new job and said he wasn’t really into Mega Man, she replied she hadn’t been a Mega Man player until she was trying to get this job. This bothered the people looking through her tweets, since she’d said to the community she loved X. When asked about it she explained that she’d played X years ago and liked it but never really followed through, and played Mega Man Classic stuff in preparation for this job. Fair enough (or it should be at least).

    But here’s the thing: the people who went through her tweets meticulously looking for things to be angry about somehow missed:

    “Just bought Mega Man 2 on 3DS! So toughness! Much Humiliation!” “Finally getting around to playing Mega Man 2. I’ve got three stages and the middle square left! So good!” “I was worried it’d feel too dated at first but… Complete immersion took over! It’s too bad I missed out on that era of gaming!”

    Strange that they found the tweets they used to claim she never played Mega Man, but missed the ones where she was literally playing Mega Man and took a photo of her progress.

  • Peter Quill

    For that Goal. There was another to add her into the SP experience with her own boss/bosses.

  • Matt Lyte

    What movement are you talking about? No-one is “allowing” harassing assholes to harass anyone. You’re placing an unfair amount of responsibility on people who just want to jump and shoot.

    And I’m not trying to get in anyone’s head and convince them of anything they don’t want to agree with. If they don’t like my opinion of this blog, they should try to change it. This article isn’t very well researched.

    And I’m not arguing to a jury, here, nor am I saying you need to believe me. There are starving kids in Africa right now, priorities. However, those who have followed the situation much more closely than you for much longer than you have made educated inferences, so there’s not much for you to argue.

  • Anonymous

    Actually she did play the games. She played some X years ago, and played some Classic stuff in preparation for this job.

    I know some people went through her tweets and found a tweet of her saying she hadn’t been a Mega Man player until now.

    I also know those same tweets had her saying that she was playing through Mega Man 2 on the 3DS. A very convenient omission was made by the people trying to prove she wasn’t qualified.

  • Matt Lyte

    Probably because it takes more than downloading a game in order to get a job to fulfill their expectations of a great mega man game with no drama getting in the way.

  • Anonymous

    No, I don’t think that’s why the people claiming she’d never played Mega Man left out the part where she was literally playing Mega Man.

  • Herbert West

    …the movement… ???

  • Matt Lyte

    I think you’re missing the point of what they’re getting at, which is that they didn’t back the project for some untested, incapable person to come along and act as their mouthpiece. Especially when that person’s incompetence and past history will inevitably lead to blogs like this one jumping on the story and painting everyone on the “other side” of it as misogynistic pigs so that their viewers will say “yes, very good, I agree with feminism, tell me more about the bad people and how we’re better than them.”

    The problem was never her, it was the position she was entrusted with irresponsibly.

  • Herbert West

    “she was a designer for the game. Which she’s not.”

    “when asked to, I also contribute ideas and sketches to our amazing artists here (Komaki-san, KimoKimo-san, etc). But I am by no means a senior artist, and everything goes through them and their judgement and filter.”

    It’s like some people desperately don’t want to admit they’re wrong. Does she have any input in the design? Yes. Nobody asks whether she’s senior designer.

    Also “missed the ones where she was literally playing Mega Man and took a photo of her progress” ?

    Look, I can go out and buy a copy of Ninja Gaiden, I can even play it for 10-20 minutes. Should that be counted as “having played the games” ? Would I have any in-depth knowledge of the series? Its design principles? The history behind it?

    No.

  • Herbert West

    “Hey, I played some BLAZBLUE for a couple of afternoons. Please, Arc Systems, can I have a job talking to the hardcore fans of the game? I’m pretty sure I’ll do a good job. I mean, I’ve argued with some of them, but that’s ok. Now I’ve PLAYED the games, I’m pretty sure I know what I’m talking about.”

  • Anonymous

    You think I said I don’t frequent the forums?

    I said most backers don’t. Most backers. I am not most backers. There are over sixty five thousand of us and there’s no polls going on at the moment. No, most of the people backing this are not checking the forums. I am because I’m very much into Mega Man.

    A community manager is a glorified moderator also expected to relay particularly popular ideas to the creative staff. Some of that will be in the form of input on polls. They preferred to have someone bilingual that lives in Osaka. She’s bilingual and lives in Osaka. She’s literally right there. As job qualifications go being literally right there is important.

    My “slander” has consisted of pointing out that Heavy and his peers have yet to demonstrate how Dina’s political opinions would negatively input gameplay, and of pointing out that some people put her personal life through unwarranted scrutiny. I’ll add to that by saying that because they went through her personal life and took things out of context, they came to incorrect conclusions which they spread in alarmist tones.

    I am not a Nazi. But that’s what a Nazi would say, isn’t it?

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    You DO realize you just spouted the troll equivalent of “I know you are but what am I?” back at me right? Because pointing out that your blatantly misogynist trolling made no logical rational sense is a very logical sensible observation, therefore “same to you” is probably the stupidest retort possible, and only proves beyond all doubt that you ARE in fact a misogynist twit trolling us for LULZ because you have nothing better to do.

  • Peter Quill

    She said she started downloading/playing them after getting the job. Prior her only experience was X and it was also her favorite, favorite implies she played more than one considering it’s a 20yr series. Passion for the megaman series is one of the criteria for getting the job.

    The heart of this matter is a trust issue. No one knows whats really going on and no one, not the mods on the forums or any of the Devs are showing transparency on the matter. Instead posts are edited and posters are being banned, some for just referencing 80′s anime.

  • Anonymous

    So, to do an extremely thankless low-paying job as a moderator on a bilingual board passing on information to the staff, it wasn’t enough to find someone bilingual, living right there, with an art degree and some industry experience doing game design, they ALSO needed to make sure she had played all the Mega Man games. And to played them consistently for years.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    Nice try but no. I DID read the pastebin and you’re still a sad lying misogynist troll whining for attention for your depressingly ignorant views. But way to prove AGAIN you’re just a sexist troll by automatically assuming I can’t possibly know anything about the subject.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    No sweetie, we’re calling you sexist because pretty much everything you say proves it to be true.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    Yes they do, as do I and everyone else who’s replied to you. The only one here spewing BS is you.

  • Peter Quill

    Yes actually, it’s in the KickStarter

    “Every aspect of development—art, level design, music, programming, etc.—is being handled by veteran Japanese game creators with extensive experience in the genre, and with Mega Man in particular, all the way up to and including the project’s leader, Keiji Inafune himself! Backers will have unprecedented access to seeing this team at work through blogs, podcasts, videos, concept art—the works!”

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    Really? Justice? You’re actually going to claim forcing an upstart company to fire a woman JUST for being a woman who drew something is JUSTICE? No doubt left, you’re an MRA and you have no valid points, you’re here solely to troll us because it’s the only way you can feel important.

  • Anonymous

    She specifically said “I am not in fact working on the Mighty No. 9 game development in any way”.

    Comcept is a small startup company. They hired her to do some moderator work because she’s bilingual, and since she’s an artist that’s done game design in the past they can maybe throw some work at her at some point. She is not doing game development for Mighty No. 9.

    People freaked out that she’d change the character designs or the whole design of the game. It was an entirely unwarranted fear caused by people looking through informal conversations she had with her friends and jumping to conclusions.

  • Anonymous

    Every aspect of development is being handled by veteran Japanese game creators with extensive experience in the genre, and with Mega Man in particular, all the way up to and including the project’s leader, Keiji Inafune himself.

    She is not working on the game development.

    You want a veteran Japanese game creator with extensive experience in the genre to be doing the equivalent of working in the mail room? I mean, I know some of them have hit hard times, but they still have pride left.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    Er… no. I just spent a good while browsing her twitter feed and all it proves is that she IS a feminist. She has no agenda for the game she’s been hired to promote except to do her job. There are absolutely ZERO credible or valid complaints here, the outcry over her is PURELY because she drew fanart and a bunch of misogynist trolls panicked at the thought of their Megaman tribute (that isn’t actually theirs despite their backing) getting girl cooties.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    No, it does not. And no, since the only backers complaining ARE “dudebros”, since the complaints are all purely based in sexism, they would NOT care if the employee in question was a guy.

    Oh and whining about a “feminist agenda” isn’t an “opposing viewpoint”, it’s just sexist whining. If you or he had actually offered ANY valid genuine criticisms we’d have engaged you. You have not done so. So run along back to your mancaves boys, your blatant trolling doesn’t wash here.

  • Peter Quill

    Part of her job will be the handling of surveys and polls to judge characters, ideas and priorities placed on and in the game. Sure it may seem low but it’s a huge part of the game and game experience over-all.

  • Herbert West

    A CM isn’t just a moderator. A CM is in charge of way more than just trolling the forums, looking for disturbance worthy of banhammer. A CM is more akin to traditional PR reps, with the added challenge of being in direct contact with the customer base. A CM is directly responsible for brand representation to the customers, and helps to foster and grow the online community around said brand in various ways.

    CMs aren’t the sole people responsible for brand loyalty, but they are an important part of it, especially in a startup!

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    It doesn’t HAVE to be a “genre” you nitwit, GAMES ARE GAMES! You just keep proving you’re a sexist troll. Trolls like you never call a man a fake gamer for saying he likes 2D games. She demonstrated no lack of aptitude. You are grasping at straws and pulling crap out of your ass because you have absolutely no legitimate points to argue.

  • Herbert West

    You seem to have a very limited understanding of the responsibilities of a Community Manager.

    And no, I wouldn’t have wanted a veteran CREATOR for the post of CM. But I would sure have liked a veteran PR person who would know what to say, and especially in this case, what NOT to say in public.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    That’s not evidence, that’s conjecture, theory, and supposition, with absolutely ZERO proof to confirm it. You really need to stop using words you don’t actually understand the meaning of. You are not a civil responder, you’re a tone concern troll. We’ll lump you in with trolls because you ARE one, condescending at us all like we’re idiots and spouting blatantly misogynist crap with no actual evidence to back it up.

  • Penny Marie Sautereau

    The bowel movement. AKA Matt opening his mouth.

  • Herbert West

    There we go. Name-calling. Troll-accusations. The dreaded M-word.

    It’s like you didn’t even read what the guy posted. And I don’t mean just the comment. I mean the text by Heavy01.

    EDIT: So you say further down that you’ve read the post.

    Wow. I’m even more baffled.

    Ok. Now feel free to attack me.

  • Anonymous

    The comcept guys will obviously be doing the crucial work laying the groundwork for the polls. No reasonable suggestions have been put forward as to why people would be afraid of her having the job of relaying feedback on the polls/surveys.

  • Peter Quill

    Then why do they need a Community Manager?

  • Herbert West

    If there’s someone in these threads calling other people names and throwing random insults left and right, it’s you. If there’s any weight to what the mods said earlier in this post, you’ll need to learn to discuss opposite views without resorting to name-calling and insults.

  • Anonymous

    Going off that- Not to be a feminist…but to be a feminist…”The personal is political.” Thereby meaning our geek hobbies that we love so much are political.

  • Herbert West

    ” a bunch of misogynist trolls panicked ”

    Must be nice to live in a dual world like that. Except, people have all sorts of opinions, and not all those who agree (or disagree) on some matters fall under the same shadow.

  • Herbert West

    For someone who’s calling other people trolls, you’re doing mighty fine job of setting the example. Please stop.

    I was asking Inky what movement they were talking about. Inky talked about a movement of civil responders as if there was any organization behind it. There was no common ground, because it was a lot of people, with varied opinions, and more than one single issue. So to say that there was a movement for anyone to lead is a bit bizarre. The MN#9 community HAS only one person who’s supposed to be their voice, and it’s the same person so many seem to have an issue with: their CM.

  • Matt Lyte

    No a Nazi would say they were a Nazi, or they would be imprisoned. Duh.

    She isn’t even qualified to moderate, let alone be a community manager. What don’t you get about this? She can’t even reply to well thought out, civil posts, or use a forum for a few hours without needing a few days to rest.

    For being a moderator, physical location is actually pretty unimportant, I’m sorry to inform you. If all she’s doing is passing along the occasional idea, then it’s irrelevant. As I said though, she’d be doing more than just handing them a graphed printout of the poll results.

    Slander may be a bad word choice. My point with it was that there are two basic groups here: people who want to jump and shoot and not have ANYTHING get in the way of that, and people who want to fight for or against some cause. What is going on is that the people who don’t care about MN9 are eclipsing those who do, largely because of the “reporting” of blogs like this one.

  • Matt Lyte

    Who is “we?” And don’t call me sweetie, I don’t like your personality or appearance.

  • Anonymous

    To be bilingual and relay feedback, while having a small amount of game development experience to let her know what’s feasible.

    And making sure she’s doing that are two moderators and the support staff from 8-4 LTD.

    The idea that she could somehow get away with something is unrealistic because (1) I’ve yet to see a legitimate concern about what people think she might fail to relay, and (2) there’s just too many other people involved for it to be reasonable to assume nobody would notice if she wasn’t relaying information.

  • Matt Lyte

    You didn’t “point anything out.” You saw something that wasn’t there,and I don’t respect your shitty input, so I didn’t take the time to respond. No matter what I say, your opinion is well-made up and will not change. Your grammar above all indicates that you aren’t really thinking about what you’re saying.

  • Herbert West

    “Trolls like you never call a man a fake gamer for saying he likes 2D games. ”

    I call people of any sex or gender fake gamers, fake geeks, fake nerds, all the fucking time, thank you very much. I don’t care what’s in their trousers, I give a shit about whether they started playing on a heavy-sixer or a four-switch, how well they know their ratio of matter/dark matter/dark energy/anti-matter, and which set of AD&D rules had just been published when they started throwing dice and calling shots.

  • Matt Lyte

    It should be noted that Heavy01′s topic was locked because he was “repeating himself.”

    If she isn’t banning him personally, the culture surrounding her is beginning to censor the opposition, and that’s all that needs to be said to demonstrate why she is and always was bad for the game.

  • Matt Lyte

    Playing the games is more important than her physical location, any degree (especially art,) or “industry experience.” Being a moderator doesn’t take “industry experience,” as you keep pointing out it’s not exactly high-level. What it DOES take is the ability to interact at a deep level with the community, and she demonstrated she doesn’t have that.

    Also, no-one was upset that she wasn’t obsessing over the games for years on end, just that she had barely even played them.

  • Matt Lyte

    Because she’s doing more than relaying a graph, dumbass. You don’t need to hire a person just to take a poll on a forum. If you do, you certainly don’t need them to live locally. HUGE waste of money, blatantly apparent that she’s just being brought on as a relative of someone higher up, along with her tweets and her lack of having played the games.

  • Matt Lyte

    Exactly. The heart of the issue is trust and transparency.

  • Matt Lyte

    Seconded, so much seconded.

  • Matt Lyte

    I didn’t assume you couldn’t possibly know, I assumed you didn’t read the pastebin (which I still don’t believe) because you’re more interested in repeatedly spouting the same three or four insulting adjectives every time you post instead of adding anything “logical” or “rational” to the discussion.

  • Matt Lyte

    Substantiation: nonexistent.

  • Peter Quill

    It’s the way the forums are being handled at the moment. Moderators are deleting posts or editing them with plans to bring in more. Silencing any dissent by banning or sending posts to the off-topic forums. This is what sent people into an uproar. No transparency is being displayed. That, to me, is a legitimate concern as it was mentioned the backers would have full knowledge of all facets of the project.

    Also, she does help the lead character artist Kimo on designs and many are worried about the artstyle clash after seeing her own work.

  • Matt Lyte

    LMFAO

  • Matt Lyte

    She deleted all the controversial tweets from her twitter. Way to demonstrate, as you have every single time you’ve posted, that you know nothing about the issue at hand, and just want to spout hatred.

  • Anonymous

    In addition to her moderating duties she is expected to convey information to and from the staff. Yes, close location is preferable.

    I do not share your belief that it would have been possible for her to resolve matters in a way that would satisfy those who have been expressing dissatisfaction with her.

    In addition to Dina, the forums are looked at by two moderators and the support staff at 8-4 Ltd. Their collective response has been one of bewilderment. This is not a case of one person not being able to do a job, there’s several people looking after the boards and between them they’ve been unable to figure out what to do. Largely because people are still flipping out, even after the staff explained that the things people had been were worried about weren’t based in reality.

  • Matt Lyte

    I have called many men fake gamers for shit like that. How would you know otherwise? Are you stalking me Penny? Please stop stalking me and calling me sweetie.

  • Matt Lyte

    SO mad.

  • Matt Lyte

    You just shoved me into a ghetto, after insulting me I think every single time you’ve replied to me for posting my opinion. That is what the Nazis did in late 30′s germany, essentially, and I am going to report every single reply you’ve made to me as I’m officially offended.

    Moreover, you’re the one who keeps using words inaccurately. If you want to do better, try only using one or two adjectives per noun until you get a better handle on them.

  • Matt Lyte

    Also, she demonstrated immense lack of aptitude for managing a community. Do you even know what we’re talking about?

  • Anonymous

    What sort of information are you worried she would be unable to convey?

  • Matt Lyte

    Ok so now you understand that her job is to do more than relay a poll. However, information can be conveyed digitally.

    I never said she could satisfy EVERYONE. Come on man.

    If the three of them can’t figure out what to do, that’s even worse. If they can’t respond to people flipping their shit, that’s one strike against their skills, sure. But simply ignoring well-thought out, civil, popular posts? That’s different entirely, and causes one to worry about trust and transparency.

  • Matt Lyte

    I’m not the one worried about that. I don’t even care about this game. I care about justice, and a lack of it.

  • Matt Lyte

    How would they notice without paying another person to check on her? Money doesn’t fall from the sky forever.

  • Matt Lyte

    You mean like how the director of the NSA explained that what Edward Snowden got people worried about wasn’t based in reality?

  • http://melancholywise.tumblr.com/ Sophie

    It’s not uncommon for people to get arrested for internet harassment in England, and it doesn’t seem to make much difference. That said, I’m glad that people here actually face consequences for this sort of behaviour.

  • Anonymous

    I had already indicated it is not simply to relay the results of polls. In addition to moderating and collecting poll results, she is also expected to look for additional feedback to further fine-tune polls and include additional questions. To be someone looking for fans saying “how about a fifth option: Super Fighting Robot Mode?”

    And considering comcept is a small startup, it makes sense they would prefer to hire someone right there, so that they can assign her other minor tasks as need be.

    There is no good resolution possible here, only a less bad one, which they are pursuing. There is absolutely no way to calm down the people who believe that she’s a radical feminist up there with Andrea Dworkin and Valerie Solanas because she retweeted a link to Anita Sarkeesian. It’s just not doable. They would not be satisfied with anything short of her being terminated, which in turn would result in a different subset of backers being angry. However, in supporting her the company is likely to continue being positively portrayed by media, whereas doing what 4chan demands would absolutely be portrayed negatively not just in the usual small-time press such as this site, but potentially in larger news media. Forbes, Businessweek, Slate, and CNN (just to name a few) have all shown interest in articles about the difficulties women have gaining traction in the gaming industry. I have no desire to see comcept listed in the next mainstream media article on that subject.

  • Anonymous

    There’s several other people working in the forums that would notice and report it if she was ignoring a large number of people asking for something to be passed on. And despite repeatedly asking, I’ve yet to see a realistic example of information it makes sense to be worried she wouldn’t pass on. It’s Mega Man, we ask for things like “Oh, can we play as the rival?” “How about a robot pet?” and “can we make sure he can slide?”

  • Anonymous

    By calling out “all” nerds and geeks as being “hateful and afraid,” aren’t you participating in the same name-calling and generalizations that the misogynist gamers are pulling? I’ve proudly called myself a geek since decades before it was cool, and many of the people I know that self-identify as geeks are good people. I am proud to stand with them against people like the haters who harass women.

  • Lien

    The article said that Dina is not involve with design, Dina said (past tense) she was. Comcept corrected that statement saying no she is not and never was. Dana then said so as well afterward. Was she wrong? Did she get demoted? No one knows, no one cares at this point really.

    Then your entire paragraph after that can just be shorten to “she been doing her job and i personally don’t approve her method” but it is still irrelevant to the issue because you STILL do not speak for all the backers of the project, only for yourself and another group of people who is agreeing with you. Like stated above in the comment section, some backers here, at least doesn’t seem to agree with your position on her job or even care what goes on in the forum at all. It’s all forum drama to them and just wish to see the product come to reality.

    And lastly, no. I am not “desperately” wanting you to say Dina deserved it, you are making it sound this is some sort of contest and that i am losing. I am trying to say that even though you got a very strong opinion about this issue, you are failing to realize how distorted your argument is becoming here in the comment section that it can easily be interpreted as you taking the side of the harasser seeing as you are very sensitive to people who disagree with you and seem to be very desperate to answer every comment like you are being ignored by everyone in the past 2 hours. And claiming the commenters here are blind to the facts and are all ganging up on you like you mentioned many times here doesn’t put you in any better light as well.

    How about instead of repeating what a lousy community manager Dana was, just point out what you just told me, the threats she received were unjust and disproportionate. Her quality of work before the harassment, though bad you it seemed at least to you, is not the subject of hand here, least not anymore.
    If someone steals an apple and is beaten up by a mob, i am not gonna side with the mob because he is a thief, i am gonna side with the thief because he’s a human being. If a bad CM is being threaten with rape and her gender is put on the line, i won’t care how horrible she is at her job, i am going to defend her from hate for the same reason as i would for the apple thief. People ganging up on someone is wrong and no matter the justification of their anger was, it is now lost after the horrible turn of event.

  • Myron Byron

    “you’re not even considering opposing viewpoints, right?”

    White guys complaining about their opinions not being listened to. Never stops being funny.

  • Rock On

    Sigh…

    This has nothing to do with Ms Karam’s gender. Keep in mind that fans of Mega Man, which Mighty No. 9 is the spiritual successor to, are ecstatic that their original composer to the MM franchise, a WOMAN, is also the musical composer to MN9.

    What are “gamers” so upset about? Someone who was questioned about having a social/political agenda due to past ‘Tweets” (keep in mind that this is NOT an atypical usage of Twitter, and many employers also keep track of Twitter – whether it’s for the purpose of hiring or keeping track of what their employees are saying), statements that they never really knew the original/Mega Man franchise, allegations that the person was hired due to their significant others’ influence rather than their own merits and experience with the franchise.

    When asked about the perceived agenda noted above that the new Content Manager went about covering it all up/deleting their past Tweets, cherry-picked which questions they’d answer, and suddenly became a huge fan of the franchise after all (known by many as “back-pedaling”). When THAT didn’t work out they got someone else to do their job for them by answering or avoiding various questions and called it a weekend. When certain people kept pushing, the C.M. themselves locked those requests (which SHOULD have been locked, if at all, by another person to avoid further questionable action complaints).

    DOES this person have any power to control product content by being a “community manager”? I cannot imagine how, and most people realize this. They just don’t like what happened. Especially a group of people as passionate about Mega Man & Mighty No. 9 as this one is.

    Nor should anyone. I’d be fired from my job if this all happened to me. Regardless of my gender/sexual orientation/etc.

  • TheBoost

    So, people who think all white, all male centered stuff, and who get extremely upset when their status quo is qquestiondd AREN’T political, but anyone that questions it IS political?
    If game play and graphics are only whats important, why expend energy fighting against a possible girl character… unless ones objection is “political” or based on an “agenda”?

  • http://www.thenerdybird.com/ Jill Pantozzi

    If you believe someone is a troll, please do not engage them.

  • Myron Byron

    No one is fooled by this. No one.

    It has everything to do with gender. If Karam was a man, there wouldn’t be a damn peep about ‘nepotism’. She’s a woman, which means she’s subject to exponentially more abuse than men. It’s as simple as that.

    And lol at all this “she’s a not a tru Mega Man fan!!!” nonsense. Just yet another permutation of the “gurls aren’t real gamerz! Girlz don’t belong here!” rot that we’ve been seeing for years, now. Although, considering what we’ve seen in the last couple of days, it doesn’t surprise me at all that the Mega Man fandom might have a dearth of female fans…

  • Matthew Lyte

    The reasoning for her being “not a true megaman fan” has nothing to do with her gender. You dont get to change reality just because you’re ignorant.

  • Matthew Lyte

    How does my being white invalidate my point? Can you even respond to what I said or just be derisive? Moreover, any idea why I would be banned from posting here? Perhaps because civil debate isn’t what this blog is for?

  • Myron Byron

    If Karam was a man, the dudebros wouldn’t give a damn about how sincere a Mega Man fan she was. It’s just another stick to beat a woman with. We’ve been dealing with this “girlz are just pretending to be gamers!” bs for literally years, now.

  • Matthew Lyte

    LOL banned from posting, blog reveals itself to be little more than yellow journalism.

    Why do people like you always bring up 4chan like it’s some kind of secret club? I’m going to repeat myself: there are two groups here, those who think this is some kind of Social Justice issue, and those who just want to jump and shoot. The people who just want to jump and shoot aren’t “4chan” and if they happen to visit 4chan, that doesn’t change the fact that a) they’re not the ones being vulgar and harassing her, and b) 4chan is MASSIVE, and the component of it that even knows this game exists is very small relative to the whole.

    You of course are just looking for a term to label people with so you can be simple-mindedly prejudiced, not having to put too much thought into it beyond “4chan bad.”

  • Matthew Lyte

    Uh, yeah, they would. What makes you think they wouldn’t?
    EDIT: What makes you think they wouldn’t is called prejudice. Look it up.

    You’re uneducated on the subject matter, laughably so apparently. Guys insult each other over this shit all the time. The difference is yellow journalism like this blog doesn’t grab it every time and get people who need to feel useful somehow to label and prejudice against everyone involved in the name of “social justice.”

    Who is the “we” you and Penny keep referring to? Do you think you speak for some massive social justice movement? Because most people who read this would find that the only prejudice going on here is that being leveled against people who just want to jump and shoot.

  • Myron Byron

    “Guys insult each other over this shit all the time.”

    Yes, we’ve heard SO MUCH lately about campaigns of harassment and threats against men.

    “Who is the “we” you and Penny keep referring to. Do you think you speak for some massive social justice movement?”

    It just burns you up, doesn’t it, that people refuse to shut up and allow misogyny/bigotry to go unchallenged?

    “the only prejudice going on here is that being leveled against people who just want to jump and shoot.”

    Oh, look, another male complaining about prejudice.

  • http://www.thenerdybird.com/ Jill Pantozzi

    You were banned for calling people Nazis. And now you’ve come to comment again under a different account. You will be banned again.

  • http://thewrongdrum.wordpress.com/ Jeanette

    I think we need to spring into action by counter bullying: Support these two worthwhile projects by voting or backing if we can afford it.

  • Herbert West

    There were no big arguments as long as the project was on track to be a simple Megaman-like game, believe it or not. No one opposed the inclusion of a female character in the game either. The issue wasn’t with the addition of a female character. The problem arose with how some things were said, and even more so, by WHO they were said – which led a lot of people to see it as “bringing politics on to the table”. In essence, nobody was pissed when Comcept said “we’ll add a female character to the game”. People got pissed when someone said “well, I think there’s a problem with gender representation in games, and I think either the main character should be made a female, or this other female character should be made playable”. See the difference? One is a statement about a functional addition to the game. The other one is a politically-fueled statement that, in essence, leads to the same end as the first statement (ie: adding a female character to the game). The difference is that instead of just saying “we’re adding a female character”, someone adds a “because”, along with some of their personal political causes. THAT is what annoys some people.

    The core of the matter isn’t just the gender of the main character and everybody who has followed this story knows this. Development was going fine, by the numbers, and female characters were not a problem (a playable female character was one of the stretch goals, and it was reached, and exactly NOBODY COMPLAINED ABOUT IT). The problem was that someone with no demonstrated ability to manage a community of tens of thousands of fans (but who demonstrated an ability to quickly turn gameplay arguments into internet fights about cis-genderism, sexism, feminism, etc), who didn’t have any qualification for the job (aside from being able to speak the language — her actual background is as an artist), whose first involvement with the community was doing gender-swapped drawings of the characters (this rang some bell in some people, not in everyone, but it did show an interest in gender issues), who claimed to know and have close relationships to some of the members of the developing team, whose presence was not discussed during the KS campaign, and was not put to vote like some other positions were, whose limited understanding of the MM series hinders her ability to discuss it with the fans (she’s the community manager), and who resorted to name-calling/banning/deleting people and posts that disagreed with her, got a job as COMMUNITY MANAGER – essentially, the person in charge of building, fostering, and growing the community of fans around the game, and being the filtered voice of the fans to the developing team. It didn’t help any, that said person revealed she may even have a say in the design of the characters in the game. That she could be the voice of the community and have her biases influence what she thinks may or may not be worth passing to the development team worried some that the game would take a different form that the one they had backed.

  • Herbert West

    MN#9 is already backed and has been successful. Dep. Quest is already complete and people will Greenlight it, rest assured of it. Shows how much you know about something you comment on.

  • Myron Byron

    Shows what a toxic environment the Mega Man fandom must be that a legion of sexism apologists just materialize one day in the Mary Sue, make belligerent snipes at commenters, and make excuses for stalking and bullying.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    While I certainly don’t agree with the lowest of the low harassing her (I don’t like when anyone does it), I do somewhat share the concern of someone who seems to have no emotional investment in Mighty No. 9 (or its spiritual predecessor) like the fans, and through nepotism gained a position that could offer her a platform to put words in the community’s mouth to further her own “agenda” (using that word INCREDIBLY loosely). It certainly doesn’t help her case that she got rid of a lot of incriminating tweets, because there’s no way that doesn’t look bad >.<

    Granted, I don't think Inafune would make such sweeping changes to begin with, especially not at the risk of losing so much funding, which essentially just hurts EVERYONE involved, with backers pulling their donations because of some sort of whatever, and leaving the rest of us with less of a game :(

    I'm a huge proponent to at least just letting players choose the gender of their character if it has no bearing on narrative – Legend of Zelda should have tried it long ago, and I hope they do with "Zelda U", just to actually change things up and get with the times.

    However, I really don't like the design she made of a "female" Beck. Maybe it's the style, and how the face does not at all match the proportion style of body, or the design of the body at all. Of course, that's really just me.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    It’s always the loudest that makes everyone look bad, in ANY community.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    There’s more to her tweet than just “I’m not an MM player”, the second part of her tweet said that she mostly backed the project because her friends/BF work for Comcept. People see her as having misplaced concern for the project.

    Gaining a position with possible clout through nepotism didn’t make matters any easier, either.

  • Myron Byron

    Can we PLEASE see this nepotism stuff for the smokescreen it is? Hint: when suggestions of nepotism are responded to with campaigns of stalking and harassment, it’s a pretty damn glaring indication that nepotism is not the issue at all.

    Networking and who-you-know is a huge factor in getting a job in the games industry, but of course here the nerdbros are using it as yet another angle to harass a woman.

    Oh, and deleting ‘incriminating’ (wut?) tweets? Yes. Ms. Karam is perfectly entitled to protect herself from misogynist abusers. The past few years have demonstrated that protecting yourself is a very prudent thing to do.

  • Herbert West

    I’ve commented on this blog before. I’ve been here for quite a while. I usually don’t argue with people so much. I don’t make excuses for stalking, and bullying is bad no matter which side of an argument does it. I just like to read complete stories, not stories that leave some part of it out to make for better biased, “cause journalism”. I don’t think any of what happened with Comcept and its CM excuses the death and rape threats or the sexist jokes. But there was a story that was worth telling before it turned into that too. And people here and most of everywhere else didn’t report on it until things turned beyond sour and assholes pushed it too far.

  • Herbert West

    You seem to imply that all those who were against Dina getting the job are “nerdbros” out to harass a woman. Yet while you talk of other people having an obvious bias against a group of people (women), you yourself have a bias just as obvious against another.

  • Myron Byron

    “I just like to read complete stories, not stories that leave some part of it out to make for better biased, “cause journalism”

    Yes, because as the last few years have taught us, the perspective of straight white male gamers never, ever get to be heard.

  • Myron Byron

    Oh, look, another male complaining about being discriminated against. Another member of the most privileged group on earth complaining about being the victim of bias.

  • Herbert West

    ::The point:: —–>

    Your head

    GG

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m not trying to rationalize their behavior – they’re totally a buncha dicks and I really don’t ever think that’s acceptable to do to anyone.

    However, I don’t think that just because the level of dissent has risen to harassment is any reason not to question Dina’s validity as the community manager. Just because an asshole uses those same complaints doesn’t make it any less valid than it could be by level-headed individuals.

    Her deleting her tweets may come from a place of protecting oneself, but it also sends an odd message to different people, that both she’s willing to either “go back on what she says” or “hide incriminating evidence”. It’s just a situation where no matter what it’s going to look bad to someone, and at that point I say it’s better to just stand by one’s convictions.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    Wait, so if someone is “privileged” they aren’t allowed to hate being discriminated against…? That doesn’t really jive with my definition of equality.

    It’s certainly not going to carry the same inherent value as others who are discriminated against, but it doesn’t negate their own feelings on the matter. Discrimination is bad, no matter who it happens to.

    Why don’t we just go ahead and say that all the people concerned about the quality of the video game they donated to is a First World Problem and be done with it :(

  • Myron Byron

    You’re not that mysterious, sadly.

    You couldn’t care less about ‘both sides of the story’.

    If you DID, you would have to make the painful acknowledgement that your Man Opinion is given a premium in this world. If you cared about ‘all sides of the story’, you would have to acknowledge that the opinions of women/minorities are second-best. If you cared about ‘all sides of the story’, you would never, EVER make the ridiculous assertion than Manpinions are ever, EVER ‘overlooked’,

  • Myron Byron

    If you feel that you’re being discriminated against because people are calling you out for your bigoted actions, then, yeah, that’s my cue to stop taking you seriously.

  • Herbert West

    “You’re not that mysterious, sadly.”

    Never claimed I was.

    “You couldn’t care less about ‘both sides of the story’”

    Is what you say.

    “you would have to make the painful acknowledgement that your Man Opinion is given a premium in this world”

    I don’t need to state the obvious.

    “you would have to acknowledge that the opinions of women/minorities are second-best”

    In a general, social context, yes. Not to me, not in my daily life.

    “If you cared about ‘all sides of the story’, you would never, EVER make the ridiculous assertion than Manpinions are ever, EVER ‘overlooked’,”

    Strawman.

    And bollocks.

    I still say there is a part of the story that people claiming to report on it fail to detail, and I call that lazy journalism. Period.

  • http://thewrongdrum.wordpress.com/ Jeanette

    Happy to not have the complete story! Still going to vote on Greenlight when I get home. Every little bit helps.

    Commenting at work, I have lots of websites blocked. So I can’t always follow the links. Unless you’re saying it was a bad idea to support these projects to begin with?

  • Herbert West

    Both are worthy projects.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    Well yeah, if you’re calling someone out for being bigoted, but you responded to someone who wasn’t talking about the bigots, and was instead talking about the concerns of the level-headed backers, like I was :/

  • Important Film Maker

    I laughed but then I was sad.

  • Myron Byron

    “In a general, social context, yes. Not to me, not in my daily life.”

    Oh, so you personally value minority opinions as much as privileged male opinions? And yet, here you are, in this very blog entry, tirelessly making excuses for and minimizing a harassment campaign designed to silence women.

    “Strawman.

    And bollocks.”

    It is a perfect description of what you’ve been doing here. The last few years have clearly demonstrated to us that society places massive importance on the opinions of males, and yet here you are trying to sell us the idea that a crowd of sexually-harassing nerdbros have not had their proper say.

  • Myron Byron

    Okay, so the level-headed backers feel their concerns are not being given as much attention as the horrifying campaign of stalking and harassment against Ms. Karam, ergo the level-headed backers are victims of discrimination?

  • Herbert West

    “And yet, here you are, in this very blog entry, tirelessly making excuses for and minimizing a harassment campaign designed to silence women.”

    Did I say that? Did I say that anything excused what they did, or that the harassers shouldn’t be dealt with according to their behavior? No. I said the opposite, many times.

    I also did not erect strawmen, I only stated several times, that this story has many chapters, most of which were not detailed in the shoddy reporting of sites like this and many others. THAT IS ALL. And despite what you seem to think, the initial complaints didn’t come from an audience of “dudebros”, but were legitimate questions by a lot of backers.

    What part of “NONE OF THE INITIAL HAPPENINGS EXCUSES THE BEHAVIOR OF THE HARASSERS LATER ON” don’t you get?

    This is an abridged version of the story. I want the unedited.

    You will not admit that I can see the horror in the harassment, and I can denounce it just as much as you can, but I still want to read the whole story. Because that doesn’t fit into your picture of “US vs THEM”.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    No. Wow. Those are two different things entirely.

    Herbert West and I were talking about how even though some people have gone way overboard into harassing her, it doesn’t negate the legitimate concerns that backers have had.

    His second statement (“Yet while you talk of other people having an obvious bias against a group of people (women), you yourself have a bias just as obvious against another.)”, I’m not sure what he was saying, so you’d need elaboration from him.

    However, when I responded to you, it was because I read that you were implying that if you’re privileged you aren’t allowed to complain about being discriminated against (“Another member of the most privileged group on earth complaining about being the victim of bias.)”.

    However, that is all beside my main point.

    At most, all I can say is that the level-headed backers’ concerns are being overlooked because a bunch of bigoted jackasses took those same concerns too far.

    You calling the nepotism a “smokescreen” implies that there’s no legitimacy to the concern and it’s all just for the sake of having another reason to harass her. I have a concern about the nepotism, but I’m not some bigoted dickhole and I had no part in the misogynistic harassment she got.

    I’m just a normal person with a normal concern.

  • Magnesium Cookie

    One of the things that really bothers me about this, besides all the misogyny, is that my favourite thing about Kickstarting games, is giving developers the opportunity to make their games without having to give into the demands of a large publisher in exchange for funding. But now everyone who pledges $10 to a project gets to decide how the developer runs his or her company?

    And frankly, anyone who knows anything about how developers work knows that a forum administrator (or even an artist or writer) has nowhere near the authority that these trolls are attributing to them. Dina’s not going to get to rewrite the whole game. She might get to make a suggestion in a team meeting, but the designers can do whatever they like with that. Jennifer Hepler was one writer answering to a team of writers who answered to a team of producers and game designers who answered to a team of executives. They’d also be aware of the fact that, like most competitive industries, getting jobs in the games industry hinges greatly on your personal connections. If they actually investigated the rest of the staff working on MN9 the way they did with Dina, they’d find that most of them probably got hired through friends, family, and former coworkers. In short, the trolls are irrational morons.

  • Anonymous

    I am a backer for Mighty No. 9 and had tried participating in the forums. I wish it was possible to delete my forum number just so I don’t have to associated with those people anymore. They’re that embarrassing.

    I have a question to all you gamers out there. Since when was it okay for people to lose what little shred of decency they have over something as trivial as video games? I see this a lot. It happened to me when I talked to Dina like I owned a share in some stocks. It took me 3 days after I figured out about this mess to figure that in reality, a lot of the backers are really just a bunch of entitled douchewads. They are so entitled they are willing to make another person’s life miserable just because she has beliefs that they do not agree with. That is not okay. You also cannot claim “freedom of speech” for yourself when you are trying to silence someone else. That is asinine at best.

    Not everybody bought into the whole “feminist agenda” thing that these guys are all harping on about. I didn’t. Sadly a lot of them did. A lot of them honestly thought this was going to be pushed into their games. The fact that these guys, judging from how a lot of them were willing to talk to this woman, care this much for a video game really shows that I not only live in a first world country with a “gimme gimme” mentality, but it also really makes me lose my faith in humanity. This is just sick.

    I’d give my back teeth to live on another planet.

  • Anonymous

    These people do not remotely represent the Mega Man fandom as a whole. An extremely small minority of backers went to 4chan and whipped up the people there. There’s over sixty-five thousand backers, in a group that large you’ll get some rotten eggs.

  • Myron Byron

    Ugh, yeah, I shouldn’t tar everyone with the same brush. Apologies.

  • inurashii

    If you have actual chemical depression, sex is like exercise or healthy eating. It helps, but it’s miles away from being able to cure it. Believing that depression will just go away if you get laid is … a long shot.

  • inurashii

    Female agency as stretch goal.

  • Lea Tapp

    WTF is wrong with men who treat women like this? How can any community give cover to such rabid bigots? I have a daughter who is a gamer is interested in programming and art. Game creation is definitely something she’d like to do. Is she going to have to go through this horror show too just to work in a field that interests her? FFS, I know women who work in construction who don’t have to put up with as much sexist, hateful shit as this. The gaming community needs to sort itself out.

  • Lea Tapp

    That sounds like an excuse for complacency to me.

  • Lea Tapp

    No. Women have done nothing at all to earn the sexist’s opinion of them. Geek culture on the other hand has indeed earned the image of being hateful and afraid when it comes to women.

  • Lea Tapp

    Yeah, I think they are. Continuing to say, “Oh, they’re just a minority”. Is saying, “This isn’t really a problem.” It’s the same old thing that gets tossed out when women are harassed in any group. Our concerns are minimized and brushed aside, just as some people are doing in this thread. It is a problem and no matter how small you assume the number of misogynist harassers are, there are certainly enough of them to be concerned about.

  • Lea Tapp

    I don;t think the problem is with your language skills, which seem fine btw. The problem is in your attitude toward this problem.

  • Myron Byron

    But she’s not even a Mega Man fan!

  • Lea Tapp

    Stop and ask yourself why your first priority is to minimize this problem and defend the men in your community rather than listen to the concerns and real issues the women in said community are facing. Here’s a clue: people do this every single time women speak up about abuse and harassment in any community.

  • Anonymous

    Seems to be a trend.

  • Anonymous

    Oh, and one other thing. Dina is not the cause of all this commotion. The backers are. They could have been civil if they were truely uncomfortable, but they chose not to be. Many of them chose to be as demeaning and ugly as possible. They chose to use the language they used. Those chose to make a mountain out of a mole hill. I myself chose to follow the herd til I wised up and realized I am talking to a real human with REAL FEELINGS! Take responsibility for your own actions and realize it is those actions that are getting our game all this negative attention, not Dina.

    If you still feel she is to blame and you are the victim in this “injustice,” then I suggest getting some perspective from different sources that do not have to do with video games. Go volunteer at a homeless shelter. Go volunteer to a shelter for battered women. Go do charity work in a country with high poverty levels. Oh, that’s right. You don’t want feminism or any other “SJW” junk in your game so you can shelter yourself from real problems like that. I didn’t know your first world problems mattered that much! Yet I notice it is okay to play video games that have to do with war in impoverished countries. Funny how we pick and choose what “agendas” we want in our games, right?

    “But I donated $100 (or whatever obscene large amount) of my own money to this!” It’s your money and you can choose whatever you want to spend with it. I cannot make that decision for you. That doesn’t give you the right to be a tool to another person you don’t agree with. You’re just coming off as a complete douche and a nerd who is too rich for his own good.

  • Herbert West

    It’s funny that you assume I’m a straight white guy. You think my real name is Herbert? You think that picture is me? Or is it because I say some things that fit within the framed picture you have of some people?

    It’s also funny that you paint me with the same color as people who harassed Dina when I repeatedly said those asshats need to be dealt with.

    Really, it’s hilarious. Because the harassment is not at all what I’m talking about. I don’t need to talk about how horrible it is. Because it’s been talked about already. Because everybody, including me, is already angry at how ugly things got and how some people crossed a line that shouldn’t be. That’s not my point. It never was. It never will be. Yet you are determined to make me look as if I had said things I never did, and to inject intentions in my posts that were never there, in order to discredit anything I have to say. I don’t have to comment about how angry I am that someone got threatened again by a bunch of sexist pricks on the internet. It’s sad, and it has to be fought, but my point is another thing entirely, yet you keep on NOT wanting to see it.

  • Anonymous

    It doesn’t matter if Group A are assholes because they’re sexist or if Group B are assholes because they’re jerks. They are all still assholes. It doesn’t matter the fuel to the fire, the harassment needs to be cut out.

  • Prospekt

    So, uh. Where’s your evidence? Where is the proof that this is only a vocal minority? I mean, if it was only a minority that was assholes, wouldn’t the majority who consists of these kind, reasonable people be able to just fight back really easily and shut them down? Where were they on Zoe’s Depression Quest page, fighting for her?

    I absolutely hate whenever people use the phrase “vocal minority” because they rarely do the actual statistics on it, and just don’t want to feel uncomfortable with the group they’re in.

  • Lea Tapp

    We have pictures of her as a babe in arms being held while her dad and I game. I’m not a console gamer myself (Not since I was a kid with an Atari or old Nintendo anyway), but when MUDs were still a thing, I found it was something I could do while I was home recovering from my C-section. So, she was literally introduced to gaming as soon as she was born. She’s grown up with D&D, Magic, etc. and yes, she’s played plenty of Megaman. But, since she’s female I’m sure you’re right. She’ll be expected to prove her “cred” at every turn to worthless geekier than thou dudebros.

  • Myron Byron

    lol, I am so, so sorry, I was not being serious with that previous post – just making a reference to certain individuals’ skewed priorities. I’m sure your daughter will be a glowing addition to the gaming industry, if she ever decides upon that path.

  • Lea Tapp

    No, victim blamer. The people responsible for this woman’s harassment are the harassers. This is not a molehill. This is a mountain and minimizing the problem and trying to deny it is not going to work. OK? We aren’t stupid. We know this is wrong and you should too. Stop making excuses. You are being part of the problem rather than part of the solution. If you aren’t going to help, get out of the way.

  • Herbert West

    “[...] your first priority is to minimize this problem and defend the men in your community rather than listen to the concerns and real issues the women in said community are facing.”

    Where. Did. I. Say. That.

    Please. Where did I minimize the hurt those assholes did. Point it to me. Please. This is a valid discussion, but this situation is about more than that one, VERY BIG, and very damaging issue. There were other aspects that were worth talking about, that are completely obscured, because the behavior of some assholes have polarized the discussion and transformed it into something else.

  • Myron Byron

    “It’s funny that you assume I’m a straight white guy.”

    What, so you’re a woman who thinks men’s opinions don’t get listened to? You’re a woman who thinks men are the victims of discrimination? You’re still hideously, horrendously, hilariously uninformed, then.

    “It’s also funny that you paint me with the same color as people who harassed Dina when I repeatedly said those asshats need to be dealt with.”

    I paint you with the same color as those asshats because you’ve just spent two days trying to minimize and lure attention from the fact that a woman has been stalked and harassed. Because you think it’s more important that people talk about nonsensical complaints about NEPOTISM, and NOT A MEGA MAN FAN, and SHE DELETED TWEETZ, than the fact that a woman was set upon by a misogynistic mob.

    We’re not as stupid as you think. You can’t just trick us into not paying attention to bigotry and discrimination.

  • Herbert West

    You respond to ” Dina is not the cause of all this commotion. The backers are” with “The people responsible for this woman’s harassment are the harassers” which is, ironically enough, exactly what the person you’re responding to was saying. Your whole post is calling someone a victim blamer, when they themselves are calling out the assholes who harassed Dina.

    Wow.

    “You are being part of the problem rather than part of the solution. If you aren’t going to help, get out of the way.”

    Translation: “This is about what we want it to be about. Anyone who thinks about discussing anything else than this one cause we’re espousing is an enemy and should be silenced accordingly.”

    Am I understanding you right?

  • Herbert West

    Holy crap.

    By all means, pay attention to the bigotry all you want. But if what you do is boil stories down to this constant war against the patriarchy, you’re oversimplifying things to a dangerous degree and polarizing entirely different groups of people with very varied opinions in a simple, dualized B&W world that fits into your embattled cause.

    That’s ok, I guess, it’s just not ALL there is to it.

  • Myron Byron

    Translation: “This is about what we want it to be about. Anyone who thinks about discussing anything else than this one cause we’re espousing is an enemy and should be silenced accordingly.”

    Aaaand yet another example of men whining about being a disenfranchised, censored, cut-off minority.

  • Anonymous

    There’s over sixty-five thousand of us backers, and the small minority of backers that found something objectionable went out to other sites and got people there worked up too. Currently there are no polls going on. The game development has not reached the point where comcept is looking for our input. The vast majority of backers are continuing to go about their daily lives, happy they supported the project, blissfully unaware of what a small minority is doing.

  • Myron Byron

    “pay attention to the bigotry all you want.”

    You’ve just spent the last two days trying to distract us from the bigotry.

    “you’re oversimplifying things to a dangerous degree and polarizing entirely different groups of people with very varied opinions in a simple, dualized B&W world that fits into your embattled cause.”

    Oh, look, another male complaining about the most powerful, most privileged group in the world being misrepresented, and having their opinions twisted. Male opinions are more valued than any other in this society. The notion that males don’t get their views heard will never stop being hilarious.

  • Herbert West

    Protip: My real name isn’t Herbert West, and it isn’t a cue as to my chromosomes. Thank you for not assuming any more things about my sex, gender, color, social group, nationality or whatever else.

  • Herbert West

    Do I have to post my tits for you to stop calling me a man? By now, I’m starting to think it would be worth getting banned for. JC, you’re annoying.

  • Myron Byron

    As I said earlier: if you’re a woman who thinks that society does not place a massive, MASSIVE priority and importance on men’s opinions, to the absolute detriment of the opinions of women/minorities, then you’re every bit as misguided and uninformed as you would be if you were a man.

    If you’re a woman…your posts look equally as wretched, sorry to say. Doesn’t change a thing.

  • Myron Byron

    The last few years have shown us that women are perfectly capable of misogyny.

    Once more: if you’re a woman who thinks that society does not place a massive, MASSIVE priority and importance on men’s opinions, to the absolute detriment of the opinions of women/minorities, then you’re every bit as misguided and uninformed as you would be if you were a man.

  • Dara Crawley

    Ok, but my point still stands”I have not seen anything where other people have been investigated and questioned. ” so basically because she is not an industry vet. So no one new has ever worked on the MM series or a capcom game? I am just saying I have never seen this reaction before to someone knew who isn’t in a position of power. Plenty of designers have styles at odds with a product they’re working on. Do people think that every designer at Bioware does everything in exactly the same style? Are people that stupid? Individual style does not dictate the work done on a team product. Most people who design anything from video games to comics, etc. have to subdue their style somewhat to form a recognizable brand even when they’re style is massively different. Besides who is to decide what style is “at odds” with a game? The fans? No, not at all. The people leading the effort to make the game. Yes, exactly that. I’ve just never seen this much derision directed at men in the industry in this way, unless they’re in a position of significant power. Even then no one questions whether they’re legitimate or not, or whether they’re credentials stack up.

    I’m not arguing about forum manners. I’m mostly arguing that this doesn’t necessarily relate to the actual reality of how she does her job elsewhere. The whole saying “I’ve never played” then “This is my favorite game” thing is a shitty thing to do, but I understand why she did it. Women are never real gamers within the community or outside. So you look for an in route, and if your honest you get burned and if your not then you get broiled. I don’t know what she said exactly, so I can’t make much more of a comment on that. But there is a difference between saying “I haven’t played (certain) megaman games” or “I don’t really play MM games” and “I don’t play MM games”. I would say “I don’t really play MM games” however I watch other people play them and I enjoy it. I also played MM64 and enjoyed it. Has someone asked what she meant or has she just flat out been denying she ever said anything?

  • Herbert West

    Stop with the strawmen, FFS. I did not say that society isn’t generally skewed in favor of white, straight, males. I didn’t say we shouldn’t fight back against a system that disproportionately favors its own side against all others. I say that if you’re going to report on a story, report on it, fully. There’s no need to omit facts, or inject your personal bias into it, just report on the whole damn thing, and don’t pretend that your article says it all when it obviously doesn’t because you admit to not having access to all the information. The assholes will still be assholes, the threats will still be threats, the damning evidence against the harassers will still exist. None of it will undermine the feminist cause, it will only be a more comprehensive report of the situation.

    That. Is. All. I’ve. Been. Saying.

  • http://www.thenerdybird.com/ Jill Pantozzi

    I have a suggestion. How about you both stop arguing with each other since it’s getting you nowhere? I think a lot of folks in this thread could use a break from the computer.

  • Vian Lawson

    Well, let’s take, as an example, the reaction to Anita Sarkeesian’s Kickstarter. A vocal but relatively small group of asshats got abusive and violent, and the kind, reasonable rest of us backed the hell out of her Kickstarter for a great deal more money – more than she was hoping to raise, given by people who were furious at how she’d been treated, as well as by people who wanted to see what she had to say. Backers who otherwise wouldn’t have heard of it wanted to show that the bile was unacceptable, and that she had a perfect right to ask the questions she was asking, and ask for support to do so. It’s happened time and again, with the Fake Geek Girl thing, with the time that Neanderthal douche said sexist sledging was just part of gaming culture; a much larger group rises to the occasion and says “this is not acceptable; you don’t speak for us, and who died and made you Batman anyway?”

    I can only speak for myself on the Zoe’s Quest issue; I’m not prepared to directly engage the dogpile of cretins who’ve attacked her, and I doubt it would do anything other than to raise my blood pressure. I acted in support of her by voting for her project, and sent it to my gaming friends so they could support it, and I’m sure a lot of other people. seeing what she’s been subjected to, will do the same. And I hope it gets greenlit, and that making her art will be the best revenge.

    I’m not going to do a statistical study, but use your eyes, and look at the pushback when this sort of thing happens. Many, many more people react against the “ewwww, cooties” mentality than react in favour of it.

  • Dehydration

    Because what people were riled up about were her lack of qualifications. Didn’t you realize how the original incident when she posted her fanart didn’t really cause much drama?

  • Anonymous

    “HOW MANY PEOPLE WANNA KICK SOME ASS?!”

  • Anonymous

    I get the distinct sense that what we’re seeing is the rise of people who were rejected growing up because they deserved to be, and now they’re being rejected even from geek culture because they won’t grow up and learn how to be at least somewhat socially functional.

  • Lea Tapp

    No need to apologize. I got the joke and was agreeing with you that that is exactly the sort of thing these guys are saying and will continue to say.
    ..and thank you. I hope she she does well and has fun.

  • Nabbic

    http://strawpoll.me/865387/r

    Here is something interesting. A strawpoll shows that “Because she’s a woman”, “Feminist” and “Social Justice Warrior” are among the least voted arguments.
    Please do not create these news articles, and please do not believe what is being said, the backer community have been completely civil bar a very small percentage.

    Dina herself created an ask me anything thread, which was full of fair and well raised concerns, as well as being posted in a very civil manner. Dina has ignored most, if not all of these concerns and simply responds to silly questions such as “Bison or Buffalo?” and answering questions no one asked.

  • Anonymous

    4chan is the last group of people to ask as to whether or not 4chan is sexist.

  • Ashe

    I’ve developed enough sigh-specific air to last three and a half days without pause.

  • Ashe

    Individuality is a luxury when faced up against a widespread cultural issue.

    I’m a geek, with many geek friends of all shapes and sizes, and I won’t hesitate to call out the community for its consistently nasty behavior.

    You don’t look at a pot of soup filled with rotting vegetables and inaccurate ingredients and say, “Well, THIS potato slice looks fine. THIS onion bulb looks somewhat edible. And it doesn’t taste TOO much like cat shit.”

  • Ashe

    “There will always be assholes, like it or not. The majority aren’t. You’ll find the same reality in all communities.”

    ^ There.

    It’s the classic What-Can-Ya-Do-It’ll-Always-Be-Like-That that crops up whenever a marginalized group speaks out.

  • Ashe

    Well, don’t give men too much credit here. It’s not ignorance or immaturity. It’s a power trip, plain and simple.

    Also, let’s not associate mental illness with being cruel and malicious. ‘Being assholes to women’ is a sociological problem, not a psychological symptom attributed to manic depression or anxiety.

  • Ashe

    Generalized Anxiety Quest, on my end. Recently beat a mini-boss, but now I’m facing a long dungeon crawl.

  • Nabbic

    So that invalidates the entire poll? That well laid concerns that everyone has voted on can suddenly be ignored, simply because “I say community x is lying about not being sexist”?
    I will admit that the Quinn incident had a tone of sexism, but the Dina incident is far from sexism, and people have had actual and reasonable issues with her.
    However media have blown this out of proportion by highlighting the posts of minority, acting as if it was the majority and saying it’s misogyny.

  • Rock On

    By what proof do you use that fans are using a gender bias against the Content Manager as their primary and/or sole reason for “the debacle”?

    I have provided proof as to why it is not: The C.M.’s lack of experience at the job of being a C.M. for a website (seen by how the debacle was handled); the C.M.’s statements (which are still locatable even though she deleted them) that they didn’t know the series…then suddenly decided they did when called on it; the questionable hiring of the C.M. using the influence of a significant other already on the project (known as nepotism); erasing their online history when called on it and questioned if they had a social/political agenda; the C.M. themselves locking and/or deleting postings of people questioning these actions and apparent opinions (which in itself is unethical in ‘net terms); refusing to provide further details when their initial answers are vague (at best).

    Also to further note: In my original posting, and in this one, I have not once mentioned what gender the C.M. is, except by stating that it has nothing to do with Ms Karam’s gender. The actions described are provided gender neutral for a reason.

    Again, I look forward to see your evidence that it has EVERYTHING to do with Ms Karam’s gender. “It just does”, “That’s what always happens”, and/or “4chan” doesn’t count. This is based solely on the MN9 community itself. This is based solely on this one individual. This is based solely on this one event/”debacle”.

  • Mariah Huehner

    No, see, the story is about the sexualized harassment part. The other parts are not the issue. No one would have a problem with people’s concerns if they weren’t taking the form of misogyny. You keep wanting this to be about a “bigger picture”. Okay. How about the bigger picture that geek and gaming culture have a SERIOUS problem with sexism? That is a MUCH larger issue than this one woman maybe getting a gig you don’t think she should have or some tweets you didn’t like.

    The company felt she was qualified for reasons we are not privy to. Her internet history is out there, they used her art themselves, and they felt she was qualified for community manager. Contrary to what people think, companies don’t hire people for jobs like that just because they’re dating someone who works there. That’d be more of a deterrent.

    Further, maybe her views are WHY she was hired a community manager. A lot of geek spaces and game companies are taking a much more active stance when it comes to community policing because they’re tired of them being toxic shitholes. They’re entitled.

    Contrary to what some people might think, you can have a fun game AND also consider it’s social and political ramifications in context. Gender representation is not going away as a concern. And that’s what these idiots are really railing against: the fact that they can’t make people shut up about it.

    It’s not so much that you want there to be “more” discussed about the story, it’s that in the process you’re (intentionally or not) distracting from the issue being addressed. It simply doesn’t matter if anyone had a legitimate complaint at this point…other people made it about misogyny. That’s what needs to stop.

  • Rock On

    Your pastebin missed the part at the end where it was locked by the C.M. for ‘defamation of character against the C.M.’, to put it simply. IF the screen shot of it I saw was unedited, at any rate.

  • Rock On

    ‘Every Single Time someone questions a womans’ qualifications/etc., there is an underground/above-ground group of MEN out to destroy that woman, and if you don’t agree then you’re either a MAN and/or stupid’.

    Wow, that is not a sexist, vague, broad-sweeping generalization at ALL. Oy Vey.

  • internisus
  • Saraquill

    I don’t understand. Why would a single person, let alone many, threaten to harm the bodily and psychological autonomy of a stranger who is no threat to them?

  • Saraquill

    Many of us make an effort to be decent human beings. Please do not paint all geeks and nerds with the same brush.

  • Reina Petersen

    Because we all know that this community of tens of millions of users is an homogeneous group of privileged cis-gendered American white males who all think the same and want to keep women subservient to men, am I right? Wake up, 4chan has more users than TMS has ever had, and an awful lot of them are women. You’ll find people from all continents, ethnic groups, social classes, sexual orientation, genders, and career paths. I know it doesn’t fit with your image of it, but it’s not some uniform group of “dudebros”, and you’ll almost never find conscensus on anything there, because they do not all think the same.

  • Anonymous

    Most actual nerds keep to themselves and are concerned with academic pursuits thank you very much. Please do not associate them with angry people on xbox live, they are not the same thing.

  • Reina Petersen

    Don’t worry, I’ll stay away from TMS. I take the comments in this post as a cue that anyone who doesn’t think exactly like you do is not welcome here. All women are equal, but some women are more equal than others.

  • Snicker Snack

    You’re overgeneralizing. Geek Culture, as a whole, has not earned such an image. After all, Geek Culture can only be defined as the sum of all geek subcultures, of which the digital gaming community is only one. If you were to specify “Digital gaming community”, however, then I would be inclined to agree with you.

  • Anonymous

    Here’s my thing. If she is so disliked, was there ever any effort to bring it to the attention of those higher up the food chain? Is there a way to go over her head and relay concerns in a way that won’t get them dismissed? ‘Cause that’s what has me scratching my head here. Even a CM has to answer to someone above him/her, why all the vitriol?

  • Reina Petersen

    She is in charge of what gets told to the rest of the development team. She’s basically the gate-keeper. She reads the mail, she goes to the forums, she’s in charge of the mod team. If people want to voice an opinion or have a say in the direction the game is going, Dina’s the one who gets the message first.

  • Reina Petersen

    “As long as she isn’t editing their posts to make it look like they said something they didn’t”

    She, and the mods, did.

    Oh and btw, I wasn’t saying that it was ok for her harassers to try to gang up on her, or that it was ok for a minority to try to silence a majority. I was saying that Dina ALSO does that exact same thing, and as been trying to paint herself in a different light, pretended she didn’t say things she did say, etc. That’s what I meant when I said it goes both ways. What Lien accuses some people of doing, Dina and the mods are doing too (she was trying to silence the majority of her initial, non-rabid, legitimate detractors).

  • Reina Petersen

    I will comment on this for my last post on TMS. But what you just said applies so well to THIS very community that was founded to be the voice of geek girls of all kinds.

  • Travis

    I’m pretty sure the vitriol IS the effort to bring it to the attention of those higher up the food chain.

  • Erin Louise Madson
  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    Now see, this bugs me. People, myself included, bring up our legitimate concerns, and then there’s responses like yours that seem to imply that it’s all about the feminism.

    I don’t condone the harassment that some asshats pulled, it’s just not right, but it honestly seems like there’s a lot of people here just completely denying the concerns that Reina posted (above your comment). The job gained through nepotism with no evidence to show she’s right for the job (having industry connections is one thing, but being right for the job is another), having misplaced care for the project (because her friends/bf are on the project, not because she cares about the game being a spiritual successor), and a few smaller details like her either lying or going back on her words.

    What Reina says here perfectly exemplifies my concerns – “That she could be the voice of the community and have her biases influence what she thinks may or may not be worth passing to the development team worried some that the game would take a different form that the one they had backed.”

    I don’t care that she’s a feminist, like AT ALL. I care that she seems to have no interest in the spirit of Mega Man and its successor. She got a job she wasn’t qualified for, on a project that she has no emotional attachment to (as a Mega Man fan), where she’s supposed to handle the collective voice of a community that she probably doesn’t actually understand. That’s not a person I would want speaking on my behalf.

    Please remember that there were legitimate concerns from level-headed backers before a bunch of jerks started harassing her, using our concerns as a launchpad for their bullshit. Yes, it sucks that she got harassed, but for the love of gunblades stop thinking that there’s no validity to the concerns us nice backers have.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    So very much this – the harassment didn’t start off the controversy, and the concerns had a great deal of validity to them before the harassment happened.

    Now I get comments telling me the legitimate concerns I had were simply a smokescreen for people to attack a female in the industry. What?

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    I take offense to that. I have legitimate concerns about all this and none of it stems from the Community Manager’s gender, and just that the Community Manager has done a piss-poor job of representing and being the collective voice of Mn9 backers, as well as managing the community in general.

  • Anonymous

    it’s probably also worth noting than your sex drive can decrease when depressed…

  • Anonymous

    Yeah, ok. Kieron at CCP games did the same on the forums. Why? Because at the time he was the community manager. Moderation on forums *is part of what they do*.

  • Anonymous

    Yes and no. No, not everyone in geek culture is like that. But geek culture is particularly pervasive with misogyny particularly as it contains aspects like cosplay, conventions, games and comics where – for whatever the different reasons are – there seems to be a high chance of getting harassed if you’re openly female.

    I don’t know why “geeks” have often been synonymous with men, or geeky pursuits have been seen as male pursuits, but that seems to be a dominant and misleading idea. Some people seem very threatened by women sharing geekdom (even if they’ve been doing it for years).

  • Anonymous

    The thing I don’t understand is why such flagrantly, obviously stupid and damaging stuff gets the oxygen to balloon to a point where people can be hurt. I mean, it’s SO stupid – “sex cures depression in women!” “female fanart of a videogame character WILL RUIN IT FOREVER!” – that it actually makes my brain hurt trying to understand how it gets so out of proportion.

    I wish I could say “stop feeding the trolls” makes a difference, but there’s clearly something else going on here:

    “Comcept actually sat down and responded to questions”

    DON’T DO THAT. Don’t give them the veneer of legitimacy by responding to such idiotic nonsense. Don’t give them the oxygen of acknowledgement and publicity, because that will just embolden them – or worse, give the impression that their asinine questions have a semblance of a point. State a zero-tolerance approach to sexist drivel, then ignore them. They don’t deserve it.

    I understand the temptation to bring ridiculous stuff like that to light in a “name and shame” sort of way, or to call attention to the fact that it happens. But the sad thing is, they THRIVE on this. They don’t feel shamed, nor do they feel they’re in the wrong – if anything, controversy vindicates them. So don’t give them the dignity of a response.

  • Anonymous

    The thing I don’t understand is why such flagrantly, obviously stupid and damaging stuff gets the oxygen to balloon to a point where people can be hurt. I mean, it’s SO stupid – “sex cures depression in women!” “female fanart of a videogame character WILL RUIN IT FOREVER!” – that it actually makes my brain hurt trying to understand how it gets so out of proportion.

    I wish I could say “stop feeding the trolls” makes a difference, but there’s clearly something else going on here:

    “Comcept actually sat down and responded to questions”

    DON’T DO THAT. Don’t give them the veneer of legitimacy by responding to such idiotic nonsense. Don’t give them the oxygen of acknowledgement and publicity, because that will just embolden them – or worse, give the impression that their asinine questions have a semblance of a point. State a zero-tolerance approach to sexist drivel, then ignore them. They don’t deserve it.

    I understand the temptation to bring ridiculous stuff like that to light in a “name and shame” sort of way, or to call attention to the fact that it happens. But the sad thing is, they THRIVE on this. They don’t feel shamed, nor do they feel they’re in the wrong – if anything, controversy vindicates them. So don’t give them the dignity of a response.

  • Anonymous

    the main qualification for being a community manager is going to be communication skills rather than technical ability – though experience of liaising with communities and digital communication would be good.

    provided she declared it to her employers, knowing somebody who works for the company should also have little bearing.

  • Anonymous

    she responded to “the development of the game which wasn’t supposed to be about any agenda in the first place” and “her artwork is of questionable quality”. submitting fanart and having an opinion can be innocuous and not evidence of “an agenda” – much less that influencing the direction of the game. Likewise, she’s quite right in noting that the artwork quality of her fanart has no bearing on a job of community manager.

  • Anonymous

    “Dina is a known outspoken supporter of feminism and LGBT issues” doesn’t matter, has no bearing on her job.

    “But some people, who have read her views and argued with her about them in the past, were afraid that she was going to politicize a game that didn’t have any agenda..[...]…This was seen as validation of their fears to some people and they got pissed.”

    Ok. But again, that some people were afraid, then jumped to conclusions based on those fears, has no bearing on her personally. That seems to be far more about the insecurities of the people in question. Her fanart and commenting on the gender of the character would only influence the game if she was a dev. (and, frankly, it would still be a storm in a teacup)

    “Also, that she’s not being hired as a concept artist has little to do with the case in question”

    It does when a point you’ve made previously is that people objected to her role as community manager because the quality of her fanart wasn’t very good. It’s irrelevant to her job role. If she was hired as a concept artist, it would matter how good her art was.

    As it is, the fanart and quality there of has little to do with the case in question at all.

    “some people asked if she was going to have any input in the making of the game [...] nobody got clear answers to their questions”

    Well, it’s a silly question. Unless they have a joint role, community managers aren’t devs. They liaise between the devs and the community, communicate with the playerbase and are in charge of things like forum moderation. They don’t have imput into the making of the game. It’s a non-controversy.

  • Catalack

    That is not the same thing as going both ways. These people registered at a forum with your common set of rule framework. Abiding to this framework is something they agree to when joining, as well as being moderated accordingly.

    Moderating according to something both you and the user has agreed to is not the same thing as silencing.

  • Anonymous

    The personal is the political is a very old idea.

  • Anonymous

    “How about they’re just being pissed because they’re sick and tired of seeing their hobby being turned into what they see as a tool for social justice and political change?”

    I think that’s a good summing up of the problem, though probably not in the way you intended. ‘They’ are indeed ‘sick and tired’ of seeing ‘their’ hobby criticised in any way – but the problem is, gaming is not solely ‘their’ hobby. It doesn’t belong to a select few who get to dictate the terms. It’s media. It belongs to everyone in the same way a book or a film does. You buy it, it’s yours. Ownership does not go beyond that.

  • Anonymous

    …I admit that I do think some basic knowledge of how games work should be fairly fundamental to working in the games industry. Even if it’s just having played a decent cross-section.

    But then again, just liking writing the stories is pretty much fair enough for someone who is…a writer.

  • Anonymous

    Precisely. Her ability to do her job role should be the issue at hand. (and should have no more emphasis than other peoples ability to do their job roles).

  • Anonymous

    /facepalm

    you can’t really talk about persecution complexes when…people are actually being persecuted. Persecution complexes are for when they *aren’t*. The level of harassment dished out at one specific person singled out *is* persecution.

  • Lien

    …this video is AWESOME! Please tell me he made more of these Videogame therapist videos.

  • Anonymous

    Ding! You godwin’d the thread.

  • Anonymous

    So she deserves it then!

    …Wait. Even if all you said is true (which I’m not saying it is) it still wouldn’t justify the harassment she received.

  • Anonymous

    what are you talking about…?
    2D games are still games.

  • Anonymous

    er. well you probably shouldn’t.

    aside from all this anti-women hoohah that pops up with wearing regularity (Hepler, Sarkesian etc) the idea of being gate keepers of a community and that there are ‘real’ gamers and geeks (who get the badge of honour) and ‘fake’ gamers and geeks (who should be kept out) is so obnoxious.

    maybe some are casual gamers. maybe they’re now older and have families and less time. maybe they like some aspects and not others. maybe they don’t know or care about most of the stuff you mentioned but love the comics and games they enjoy.

    it’s ridiculous.

  • Lien

    There’s a french saying for this, “Turn your tongue seven times in your mouth before speaking”. It pretty much means what you just said and is my sentiment all together. When something involve offended people, it’s best to think very hard before expressing your opinion, especially if it doesn’t involve the topic on hand. Sometimes, it’s better to not talk back at all then try to defend your point.

  • Lien

    Aaah… i love the cat lady! It’s an incredible game! There’s a particular scene in the game involving a nurse and a balcony that mimics a scene i was too familiar with. I won’t say much about what happens to avoid spoilers but when the nurse start listing a whole list of why she is depress and how she begs the main character to just understand what she is going through… i just remember crying over my keyboard. Everything she said was something that i went through so many times. And boy, did i try everything to save her… but then i just couldn’t do it…

    It’s one of the few games i have played that deals the topic of suicide with maturity the same way i went through. I highly recommend it to survivors who want to play a game that deals with this subject.

  • Lien

    Before i even pushed play on that video, i simply looked on the right side of youtube that shows “recommended video”. We got the author’s video addressing the problem of “anita and the white knights”, his video series on “Tumblerism”, his video addressing the people uses the “White privilege” talks and under all that, there are a bunch of conspiracy videos on anita’s project and even some of amazing atheist videos. “I wonder what social circle this youtube author likes to hang out with?” I ask to myself.

    Then i pushed play. Of this 20 minutes video, 4 minutes addresses her twitter account, 5 minutes about her job and close to 7 minutes is about her background (“This job isn’t made for her… cause she’s not a megaman fan!” *audience gasp*) and how she was covering her own tracks because some backers had some “good points”. The remaining minutes barely mentions the backlash she went through, the threats and how this entire problem has been overblown since day one (Remember, this started over her fanart… about a VIDEO GAME!). Nope! According to this video, the harassers were, of course, no good people i mean hey… let’s not be stupid here… but Dina is totally bad as well! If not WORSE! So many questions were left unanswered! So many of her personal opinion were modified in such a short time! So many of her own twitter posts got deleted in 30 mins (he was precise and insistent on that fact too i like to add) and it’s totally not because these concerns are irrelevant or rude since it involve her personal life and all. No no no no, don’t get him wrong! It’s because she’s a community manager and he… oops i mean… the backers need to get answers or hear them roar! Therefor, this whole mess is her fault, at least as proven by this heroic forum stalker who spends probably an entire night searching through her private life to find evidence for his point: The backers are upsets, she is the problem and people who say otherwise to either of these two points are white knights/feminist! Oh gee, i am now seeing this issue in an entire new light now that i got some info this article failed to mention! Thanks for sharing!

    So…can i stop the sarcasm now? Seriously cause i want my 20 minutes back… And my faith in humanity too while we are at it .

    I also love his choice of vocabulary when he’s talking about her feminist views, “feminist crap”, “Tumblr S****”, etc… and his tone of voice when he starts to read her forum posts and even describing her smiley faces. Sorry, Erin, may i ask how did you discover this video?

  • Lien

    I understand your concern on that, but seeing Comcept actually taking Dina’s side kinda gives me hope to know that the behavior she had to go through in the past few days were, at least, openly acknowledged by the very same company. Yes, it may make things worse as it brings this issue to light but remember, they are also doing this for Dina herself to show the whole world she is not alone in all this, her own employers are backing her up.
    That’s something that needs to be reminded as well.

  • Anonymous

    “I will say it once again, because it bears repeating: if you’re going to report on something, why not tell the whole story?”

    Can’t be done. Because you know, patriarchy…

  • Guest

    Agreed.

  • Anonymous

    It is kind of creepy, isn’t it?

  • Anonymous

    The beginning of that video was hilarious! Thanks for posting it.

  • MrMetFan69

    It’s astounding how you feminist manipulate and misrepresent a situation to make it seem misogynistic. Not once in your garbage article did you mention regarding Mighty No 9 how Dina put questionable stuff on twitter that when asked about it she deleted it all. She made a tweet saying she never played Mega Man which is a big deal because she is CM of a Mega Man inspired game. She mentioned that her friends and “bf” work for the company and when people called her out on that bit of nepotism she got angry and even denied that bf means boyfriend. She herself stated on another tweet that she is CM and artist, two roles the artist one being the one people were afraid of because her art was crap. All of this was deleted by her but thankfully backed up. The #1 complaint on the forums have been these things not feminism. This is why third wave feminism is a joke, you guys are unable to handle criticism without resorting to victim status.

  • Anonymous

    Yikes! Of course it had to be cat! Thanks for the wake-up though.

  • MrMetFan69

    Why not educate yourself on the whole situation not what is filtered through by angry man hating feminists ? This won’t help you get laid by them bro trust me.

  • http://jbsargent.wordpress.com/ TWOxACROSS

    I believe this video was made before the feminism-based harassment may have started.

    Or, quite possibly, that it’s not about addressing that harassment, but addressing the legitimate concerns people had. Is it entirely his responsibility to report on that too? Or is he simply focusing on what most backers were concerned about. Here’s a hint: it has nothing to do with feminism.

  • The Bechtloff

    “Someone said something mean to me on the internet!” Boo freaking hoo. They’re just words, get over it.

    Welcome to the internet hun.You wanna play on these interwebs you gotta put your big girl pants on.

  • Anonymous

    I’ve heard this response before, and I find it deeply problematic. I’ve been a gamer for 25 years and have NO OBLIGATION to continue to remain in a space that is unsafe to me. Full stop. The size of their toxic voices is meaningless and saving the gaming community is not my responsibility.

  • Reina Petersen

    I was just saying I’m an equal-opportunity “call-out”-er or whatever you wanna call that. It’s not true that people never call out men on their ‘fakeness’. It just isn’t.

    Now, you had some very points to some of my other comments, although some were not at all about what I was getting at. But whatever. Please stop responding to my comments, I’ve had enough BS in my inbox from posting on this biased article, I don’t want more. I already had to make my activity private because some of the commenters here took to stalking me on other websites I commented on, had to remove all contact info from my profile because I received emails saying I was a misogynist hag, a traitor to women (not my words), that I should trans to man because I behave like one, etc.

    I’ve had it with TMS. Just please, stop commenting to me here. I don’t wanna have to make Disqus stop sending me emails when I have discussions elsewhere on the web that I wanna keep track of.

  • Charlie

    So tell us then, in your opinion, why did they get upset at her in the first place?

  • MrMetFan69

    I just explained it in my rant here. I am a backer therefore I am a forum insider. I can tell you right now 99% of the criticisms against her are because she has no experience with mega man, because it appears she got this position through nepotism, because she made tweets that contradict what she and the staff has said and when called on that she deleted her tweets. She had a tweet saying that she was now officially a community manager and artist on the team which contradicts this article and what Comcept stated. None of that is getting addressed just buried. The idea that this is all about hating woman is laughable because the person in charge of the music is a woman and no one has complained about that at all:

    https://s3.amazonaws.COM/ksr/assets/000/870/695/aca38b54d9a6edb00b22b505f1264c10_large.jpg?1377743130

  • Charlie

    Then why has the issue with Anita Sarkeesian or Beck being female come up at all. I’m a backer and a long time mega-man fan too btw and I’ve seen comments on kickstarter about that. It seems to me that a lot of her critics are trying to backpedal now they see that their hate isn’t being supported.

  • Charlie

    Dude, don’t say stuff like that. It’s just not helpful, or even true.

  • MrMetFan69

    I’m not saying some people haven’t brought it up. Yes some have. But if you actually are a backer you have access to the ask Dina anything thread and in that thread overwhelmingly the questions against her have very little to nothing to do with feminism. Everything I mentioned above is what set off this storm. Her lack of professionalism and slow rate at answering questions hurt a lot and now the man hating feminist sites like this are trying to push the misogyny angle and this would be a great time for her, as CM to step up and acknowledge that isn’t the case but what do we hear? Silence.

  • MrMetFan69

    It is true. When I was in college all the feminists who were men were single consistently. Supporting the man hating feminists actually earns less respect from them then challenging them. I slept with a lot of them and despised their ideology, that ideology being 3rd wave man hating feminism and not feminism in general. I respect woman but not man hating feminists.

  • Charlie

    Firstly The Mary Sue isn’t a ‘Man hating feminist site’ so stop it. Secondly, personally I think she’s done a bad job of managing the crisis but frankly I also don’t think some of her critics are innocent of misogyny. As a backer I’m excited to play as Call because playing as a female helps with immersion, even if it’s a robot and I don’t think she deserves hate for that or her comments on Sarkeesian. Trawling through her twitter doesn’t exactly seem like the act of someone taking that update post at face value but of hateful people looking for something to get at her for.

  • Charlie

    Feminists don’t hate men. I would call myself one and all my closest friends are guys.

    Pointing out that women won’t sleep with men who support them is in itself misogynist btw as you seem to think of woman as only good for one thing and not valuable as friends or fellow human beings. Also I’d expect any man to be with me, to be a feminist because frankly I deserve to be treated as an equal not a secondary citizen.

  • MrMetFan69

    “hateful people looking for something to get at her for.”

    This is the problem with you man hating feminists. Anyone that criticizes you or even a woman in general is a hateful person. You sure love your damning tags so you can just write people and opinions off. Grow up. No one in the forums is buying this crap. We all know why we are against her and for the majority of us, it’s her lack of professionalism and lack of credentials. Get that chip off your shoulder already. I’m in the process of withdrawing my $50 and pushing as many people to do so. After that I can clean my hands of this mess and if the project does turn up well I will gladly support it again. That’s called being pro-active.

  • MrMetFan69

    LOL I never said any of that you are accusing me of saying. Hahaha what bullsht you are full of. Grow up.

  • Charlie

    Well you clearly don’t love Mega-man as much as you profess to then. It’s a community manager not a project leader for heavens sake.
    Are you saying to me with a straight face that there has been no hate whatsoever against Dina’s gender? Because I think that’s a bit of a porkie.

  • Charlie

    ‘This won’t help you get laid by them bro trust me.’ So you never said that then? Okay. Must have been some sort of evil imposter. Silly me.

  • MrMetFan69

    I like Mega Man. I don’t love Mega Man. I have a life that doesn’t revolve around games but Mega Man was a big part of my gaming years as a kid so I didn’t mind tossing some money and checking back on this after a year. However I can’t stand basic lack of professionalism and you can surely use this as a barometer over the professionalism of the rest of the project sure.

    “Are you saying to me with a straight face that there has been no hate whatsoever against Dina’s gender?”

    No one hates Dina because she is a woman. The main composer of the game is a woman who in theory should be influencing the game more. Not one person complained. Get that whiny chip off your shoulders already. No one cares anymore.

  • MrMetFan69

    I said that yes. I never said “you seem to think of woman as only good for one thing and not valuable as friends or fellow human beings.”. This is you and your childish hyperbole which is all you have been doing.

  • Charlie

    Sorry but that sentence implies that’s how you view women. It certainly doesn’t make you look very respectful towards them.

  • MrMetFan69

    It doesn’t imply anything. It’s called hyperbole which is what you are doing. I already said I respect woman just not the subset of man hating feminists. Nice try trying to skew my words but it won’t work here. Next?

  • MrMetFan69

    That you don’t know what you are talking about? Ok sure boss. = )

  • Charlie

    Well video games are my life and to be honest I’m not going to let some internet asshats get between me and some platforming goodness.

    To me it seems like you are upset at us because we are unhappy about someone accusing her of being unprofessional. She was only in this position because someone took offense at her drawing Beck as a woman and some comments on her Twitter that they actually had to go and dig up (creepy). So I think it’s slightly unfair to her to judge her on it and more importantly completely irrelevant to the game.

  • Charlie

    It kind of does dude sorry.
    That guy said this stuff is bullshit and your immediate response was an assumption that he was trying to get sex because no one would actually want to help women legitimately for any other reason right?
    It’s actually pretty hateful towards men if you think about it :/

  • MrMetFan69

    “Well video games are my life”

    I’m sorry to hear this.

    “To me it seems like you are upset at us because we are unhappy about someone accusing her of being unprofessional”

    I showed you exactly why she was being unprofessional.

    “She was only in this position because someone took offense at her drawing Beck as a woman”

    For the 3rd time, in the ask Dina anything QA thread the majority of complaints are not about that but unprofessionalism.

    “Twitter that they actually had to go and dig up (creepy).”

    Yes no one does this. No one looks up people’s public tweets. This is a new phenomenon now that someone needs to tell internet celebrities who make money off of this about. Jesus grow up. If you are throwing yourself out there as a community manager this is fair game. Here you go again as I said above with the labeling. So childish.

    “So I think it’s slightly unfair to her to judge her on it and more importantly completely irrelevant to the game.”

    Then why did she tweet that she was CM and on the art staff?

  • http://mordicaifeed.tumblr.com/ Mordicai

    You are making the mistake of assuming he is in any way arguing in good faith.

  • MrMetFan69

    Ok. You said above video games are your life. A lot of pedophiles also are introverts who play video games non stop. By that assumption you are a pedophile. Wonderful how that works?

  • MrMetFan69

    I’m not at all misquoting his words like he is doing to me.

  • Charlie

    Maybe she was bragging to her friends or they didn’t make her post clear yet. The leaders of the project made it pretty clear she wasn’t involved outside cm but nobody listened to that. Why?

    Most people I’ve spoken to seem to go back to ‘she drew Beck as a woman’ as the root cause. That’s kind of stupid.

  • Charlie

    Erm, the assumption was yours not mine. You should reread my comment :)

  • MrMetFan69

    So you are saying she is a liar? Good. This is my point. If she is going to lie about things like this and not address it and delete her tweets and hide it under the rug she shouldn’t be CM because what else will she lie about then?

    “Most people I’ve spoken to seem to go back to ‘she drew Beck as a woman’ as the root cause.”

    Anecdotal evidence means nothing. Last time, visit the ask dina anything thread. You will see that you are wrong. I just browsed it to double check and yes 100% I will guarantee you the majority of complaints have nothing about gender.

    Now you will respond without having read anything I just typed again.

  • MrMetFan69

    So basically you agree that you stay in doors all day playing world of warcraft and looking at child porn? Well I’m not surprised to be honest.

  • MrMetFan69

    It pains me that your childish attitude has brought the argument to this point to be honest.

  • Charlie

    I didn’t say she was a liar. I said maybe they hadn’t made her post clear.

    It’s not exactly clear why they went ‘digging for dirt’ in the first place. Also there are quotes like this

    “This is a bad idea guys. I don’t want any anita sarkeesian feminism all up in my megaman reboot. I don’t want a sjw [social justice warrior] monitoring the forum, deciding who has good opinions and who has bad ones.’

    hmmm…

    Again I think withdrawing your cash over this is ridiculous but it’s yours to do with what you like.

  • Charlie

    Yes because calling someone names out of frustration isn’t a childish act at all. :)

  • Momo

    “We know that healthier people have more sexual activity. But we do not
    know which comes first. Does the good health make you more willing to
    have sex, or does the sex have a positive impact?” Did you actually read this article?

  • Momo

    It would be so revolutionary for her detractors to attack what she says and does in a mature manner instead of attacking her as a female or as a person and threatening her life and using rape and sex against her. I can’t take anyone seriously who gets so hysterical.

  • Momo

    Right; whose forum is this? Is it hers? Then she can do what she likes there and best that participants read the Terms of Service they’re agreeing to. There’s no freedom of speech in private forums.

  • MrMetFan69

    “I didn’t say she was a liar.”

    Yes you did. Thank you for agreeing with me on that we are finally making headway = )

    “It’s not exactly clear why they went ‘digging for dirt’ in the first place. Also there are quotes like this”

    That’s one quote. You are letting one cherry picked quote determine the whole attitude of the forum. Meanwhile in the ask dina thread you are allergic to there are hundreds of criticisms that have nothing to do with gender. Are you really this ignorant?

    “Again I think withdrawing your cash over this is ridiculous”

    LOL You assume your childish opinions mean anything. Adorable.
    I’ve never met someone from the UK so emasculated. It’s such a pity what is happening to you guys : (

  • Momo

    Good God can’t men ever control themselves?

  • MrMetFan69

    I’m not calling anyone names I’m showing you how dumb your assumption is. I just admitted above I feel dirty using your childish tactics.

  • Jen Roberts

    Of course they can, the vast majority anyway. And the rest are the pocketwhackers of the world.

  • MrMetFan69

    Anyway I’m out. Congratulations, you made me waste time arguing with someone who said “Well video games are my life” longer than I should of. 5/10 you get. Enjoy your lonely, emasculated, World of Warcraft playing life friend = ).

  • Charlie

    Emasculated? You know I’m female right? If you think men should act a certain way then I think maybe you are the one who hates men.

    It’s clear from that quote that people are hating on her for her gender a fact which you say is 100% false.

    Secondly I didn’t say she was a liar anywhere, I said maybe she didn’t know what they wanted her to do yet. Which is completely feasible.

  • Charlie

    I really really like video games, I’m sorry if that makes you sad, it doesn’t make me sad. :)

  • Charlie

    I haven’t assumed anything about you. You however assumed that Fiach was feminist because he wanted to sleep with women.

    Seems like you misunderstood.

  • Charlie

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ow—AaOIEo I think this puts everything into perspective. ;)

  • Vian Lawson

    You are absolutely right. You don’t have to (and shouldn’t) expose yourself to toxic culture to fight it. As I said in my response to Prospekt, above, I do not feel the need to directly engage with a pack of toxic a-holes; they aren’t interested in rational discussion anyhow. My response has been to vote for her project, to encourage my guild, my RPG group, my boardgaming group and so on to do the same (and they have). Because gamers are awesome. And we DO have the numbers.

  • Reina Petersen

    I’m one of her many detractors. I never insulted her, harassed her, threatened her, or wished rape upon her. Take off your bias-glasses, not all who oppose Her appointment as CM do it savagely, or out of misogyny.

  • Anonymous

    It’s too bad when this kind of garbage happens. Best of luck to you!

  • César H. Sandoval

    The forum is for the game’s (Mighty Number 9) backers and develpment staff, it is not “her’s” perse, she’s just getting pay to be a CM on it.

  • César H. Sandoval

    The whole game is an homage to Megaman, it shouldn differentiate from it, hence why it has a “male” robot protagonist already set in stone (“he” even has a cameo in Ninja Gaiden Z, another one of Comcept’s games), still, the game also has a “female” playable character in Call, so the gender issue is not-existant as best, it is not a role of a MM-like plattaformer game with cartoony robots to take sides in some sexism war.

    The fans are the ones making a fuzzy overblown drama, on both sides.

  • César H. Sandoval

    No, she also has a part in the single-player game and another online “race” mode.

  • Anonymous

    Yes, that invalidates the entire poll. 4chan was asked “are you sexist, or is it just that women are in the wrong?”

    That they voted “it’s not us, it’s her!” is about as useful as a poll showing that congress thinks they deserve a raise.

    I’ve looked into the matter more and more, and while some individuals are clearly worked up over what they believe to be legitimate concerns, it’s becoming increasingly apparent that the pot has been stirred by dishonest people supplying half-truths. For example, the tweets in which Dina stated she hadn’t played MM were followed by tweets of her playing MM. People passed on the former but not the latter, so when she said she’d played the games they called her a liar. Which she’s not, she played the games, it’s just that some liars decided not to show anyone the tweets with her playing them.

    People also posted the kickstarter comment in which she said it’d be cool if Beck was a girl. This has led some people to think she fundamentally disagreed with Inafune and was trying to change the game. The people that shared that screengrab ignored the very next thing she said, where she clarified she just meant a gender-change toggle would be cool.

    There’s probably lots of people that think they have legitimate concerns. But they don’t. They got stirred up by dishonest people. And that’s not cool.

  • venetian snare

    you’re making it seem like this is some misogynist led thing, people just don’t want her anywhere near the project cause she’s a SJW

  • olden

    No, I’m arguing that the majority of posts are gamers having legitimate grievances with the progress of this game – They are not calling her names or attacking her based on the fact she’s a woman but because she has serious credibility issues – Gaming as a sub-culture if you want to call it that has very passionate devotees and we can tell a fake a mile away. The slightest hint that you’re not on the level and you’re done, credibility is that important. If you want to join have at it – Male, female, black white etc… Just don’t stroll into the room having no interest or respect for the scene and then start trying to dictate how you think things should be – That’s just egotistical. Ladies and maginas – If you want a better representation of females in games here’s a tip – MAKE YOUR OWN GAMES.

  • Alissa Knyazeva

    What amused me was the shrill vocal fear of “feminist agenda” in their precious vidya games.

    Oh no. Women being treated like real human people? WE JUST CAN’T HAVE THAT NOW, CAN WE?!

  • Anonymous

    I weep for my gender. :P

  • Anonymous

    Second all of this.

  • Anonymous

    Something about intention…not being magical…especially in a discussion like this…

  • Anonymous

    Mine is Post Traumatic Stress Adventure; main enemies are sudden loud noises and unexpected exposure to sexual assault in media. (My reactions include screaming out loud, sudden rage and anxiety, with the emotional feeling I’ve just been slapped in the face).

    Side note, I played Depression Quest for a bit. It hit pretty close to home, so I had to stop. But if I ever needed someone to help empathize with me, well…there ya go. Which I suppose is the whole point.

  • Anonymous

    No. Just…no.

  • Anonymous

    Truth. These threats and harassment are the same reasons people abuse others face to face. Power. Control.

  • Anonymous

    Nope!

  • Anonymous

    Stop making this about you. Empathize with those who are harassed; it’s not that hard. Don’t apologize for your whole privileged group; it does nothing but try to push the responsibility you have onto a minority group.

  • Anonymous

    Bingo!!

  • Anonymous

    Power and control.

  • Anonymous

    “All women are equal, but some women are more equal than others.”

    whut?

  • FiachSidhe

    The Hell are you talking about? Stop making what about me? I never tried to make it about me. How the Hell did you get that from my post? I DO empathize with the harassed.

    Who am I trying to push responsibility onto exactly? What minority group? Stop talking out your ass.

  • Guest

    I love how all of my responses to this are being deleted. Way to support the people you rail against Mary Sue.

  • FiachSidhe

    No he didn’t misunderstand. MetFan is a straight up troll. He’s not subtle about it either.

  • FiachSidhe

    You used that same lame response concept earlier. Get some better material. Your trolling is pedestrian.

  • Reina Petersen

    Do you need me to explain Animal Farm to you?

  • FiachSidhe

    He’s a blatant troll. He’s going to purposefully contradict himself. He’s pretty standard as far as they go.

    Besides, he plays League of Legends. Which is hilariously appropriate considering how infamous that game’s community is, for anti-social behavior.

  • FiachSidhe

    The fact you, a self proclaimed feminist, is agreeing with a guy who is a blatant misogynist, for an unbelievably stupid comment, is absolutely astounding.

  • FiachSidhe

    Educate myself on what? The fact that you and others like you treated some woman like garbage?

    I don’t write things on the net to get laid, you clownshoe. It says a lot about you, that you think a man can not defend another human being who happens to be female, without wanting sex.

    How infantile.

  • FiachSidhe

    Ad hominem attack! The calling cards of intelligent discourse. Your troll skin is showing…

  • FiachSidhe

    Evading. You’re getting desperate. ;)

  • FiachSidhe

    Blatant trolling. You only lasted a few posts too. Usually your kind doesn’t fall apart this soon.

  • Vetinari

    Sorry, my mistake. I can see how that can be read as a kind of “well, people are people, whatcha gonna do?” type comment, which wasn’t how I meant it to come out. Obviously it’s important that people, especially those in geeky/nerdy communities, step up and do their best to prevent these events from happening and condemn them when they do.

    I simply meant to say that, sadly, these problems are always going to keep recurring, because this isn’t a sitcom and not every nerd is going to be an awkward, well-meaning guy with a heart of gold.

  • FiachSidhe

    You sound extremely bitter about women in general. and seriously? You’re an extremely petty, childish person. You’re one of the jerks talked about in the article, and simply came here to start fights.

    Which really just proves this article’s point. Like all net dwelling sexists, you can’t help but show up to defend your behavior, and remove all doubt.

    Calling her art crappy? Irrelevant, and petty. So she never played an older game that merely inspired the current one? What kind of awful logic is that? He all games are inspired by something, do all CM’s need to have played every similar game to be a good community manager? Or just the ones you claim are important?

    Yeah great excuses “bro”.

    Oh and BF can also mean best friend, like BFF? But you were probably too busy sharpening your pitchforks to notice.

    Really? She deleted a bunch of threads consisting of petty man-children like yourself going ape**** over something stupid and making the community look terrible? You don’t say!

  • Erin Louise Madson

    Found the video doing a simple search into the issue rather than relying on one source. And if you go into it with a critical mind (and over look his anti-feminist language) you can see some of his points. As a backer of (the spiritual successor) established franchise, which you’d been waiting years for, you may get worried if you thought they were going to change it after you’d already pledged. Also I don’t use Twitter so I could be wrong about this, but I wouldn’t call that someone’s personal life, the things you put there are public, and if they reflect negatively on a career you aspire too or hold that’s your own doing putting it there. No his coverage wasn’t blanket, neither as this article, it shows that a lot of the backers were not throwing gender based slurs, just worrying about their investment and asking for answers which were not promptly offered. Communication is key, and it’s her job to communicate, so if people are panicking, I guess she’s not communicating effectively.

  • Rock On

    When was the last time you were hired for a job and your employer didn’t know what to do with you, or what your specific job title was going to be? When was the last time you signed-on at a company without knowing what your duties would entail? Sorry, but in the face of reality, the “maybe she was just confused?” argument sinks faster than a gamers’ heart when they first played Superman 64. In other words: Faster than a rock.

    You also DO know who some of the fan-favorite Mega Man characters are, right? In the top ten (out of HUNDREDS, if not over a THOUSAND), are Roll, Tron Bonne, & Aile. All three are female. Roll & Tron Bonne are occasionally playable (dlc, fighting games, etc. – Tron Bonne also has her own GAME), and Aile IS a female Mega Man. The “Fans don’t want a female Mega Man” argument is also sunk in the face of reality.

    What people are forgetting is that the folks over on the Mighty No. 9 site are not just fans, they’re financial supporters. In kickstarter terms, these people are stock holders to this product (rather than the company). Do financial supporters have any right to investigate the web history of someone who is their voice to the developers? Do they have the right to ask clarification question? YES.

    In fact, I dare you to tell the shareholders at whatever business you work for that they have no right to question you about anything – if you’re ever called on to answer for something you did or said in your history for whatever reason. Or heck, even just your direct boss. The financial supporters may not be her employer, but they ARE the ones who are footing the bill for the company until they get the game to market. For a start-up, that’s huge.

    Next, since you’re a financial supporter but won’t check the Ask Dina page, here’s the results of a straw poll or two for you:

    http://strawpoll.me/871747/r – This details, “Where do you stand on the Mighty No9 issue?”

    http://strawpoll.me/865387/r – This details, “What’s your problem with Dina?”

    For the second one, here are the top 5 issues:
    1. She knows next to nothing about Mega Man
    –Sorry, but playing a bit of one game, and catching some older games on a virtual channel after getting your job doesn’t really count as knowing why fans love Mega Man and why they hate Capcom in turn. Financial Supporters immediately saw her as an outsider and a PR rep. & go-between who didn’t know the product, nor the history of the product. How can they relate and trust someone who doesn’t understand their ideals, motivations, and desires?

    2. Her art is terrible
    –Everyone is entitled to their opinions, no matter how much an opinion may or may not stink

    3. I’m worried a feminist agenda will now permeate the game
    –Don’t jump on this one just yet! What is this response really saying?

    —”There is a time and place to be proactive on social issues, and a Mega Man-esque game is simply not one of them. Mega Man/Mighty No. 9 is about being a robot, and running & jumping and blowing stuff up, and discerning the puzzle aspects of both the levels and which bosses are weak to other bosses’ weapons.”—

    Social issues belong/fit in such a game as much as Elvish rights do in Tetris or Battletoads. In other words, in Mega Man the society the game takes place in is at peace (before Wily screws it all up) and everyone works together in peace and harmony. These social issues NO LONGER EXIST in these games. There is no reason to expect anything different setting-wise for Mighty No. 9.

    4. I’m worried her shitty art will now permeate the game
    –Rather a repeat of two, but more specific about the claims she made about being a game designer as well. And since the company only has one on-going project currently…

    5. Nepotism
    –The financial backers are worried that the person who acts as their voice to the developers only got their position due to a “close friend” working at the company, rather than from their own background and qualifications and past experience at this type of job. These worries have only gotten worse as every time this question is posed the thread is locked by her. Does she HAVE to tell the financial backers her past employment history/experience? Not in detail, or really at all. But in the face of this Public Relations NIGHTMARE, some comforting information would benefit her greatly, and get a lot of people to calm down. The fact that she refuses to do so, and actively blocks any attempt to do so, is throwing gas on the fire rather than water.

    They’re also not happy that she is, herself, thread-locking each and every thread that even MIGHT call her into question in some way, shape, and/or form – even the ones calling out in support of her. She’s burning bridges like a pyromaniac in a Roman Candle factory.

    Oh yeah, and last on the list:

    13. She’s a woman
    –At 2% of the total vote of almost 30,000 votes. Yes, some people who are displeased with her performance are jerks. But by this statistic ALONE, they are not the majority speaking. They are not the ones calling her into question. They are so far in the minority that they pose as an insignificant portion of the population.

    Sorry, but you’re 100% wrong.

  • Dehydration

    Considering that this is gonna be a spiritual successor to MM, I (and most of the backers) think having at least played the games would be another. We were promised veterans. This goes to another point – although she denied involvement in MN9 design, both her tweets (literally they gave me both titles! CM and designer) and one mod post saying that she had been asked to design some concept art for KumoKumo (lead MN9 designer, welp) says otherwise. THAT would, I think, need technical ability too?

    And again, the very fact that we’re even having this discussion says something about her moderation ability, no?

  • Jenny Hozuki

    Another uninformed article where a feminist tries to garner sympathy for other feminists.

    Dina, the new community manager for the Mighty No 9 game, was not spoken out against because she’s a woman, it is because she is a militant political activist who campaigned to try to get several video games changed for feminist ideology and even campaigned to do so for the game in question, then got hired by the company despite having zero qualifications because her boyfriend pulled strings to get her the job. She is now a community manager for a game fandom for which she has never even played a game from. Since then she has strategically deleted her twitter and facebook entries incriminating her then retreated.

    Seriously, feminists and feminist supporters really need to stop with the old “you just can’t handle a girl playing games” routine. All gamers LOVE females who play games, and the music composer for Mighty no 9 is a woman whom everyone loves. What we DON’T love are militant feminists and their campaigns to censor or change games for their political interests, especially when they are proven to only pretend to be fans for their own benefit.

  • Jenny Hozuki

    Funny you should bring up Anita Sarkeesian. Since posting her Kickstarter it has turned out proof positive that Anita is NOT a gamer, DOESN’T play games, kept most, if not all of the money raised for herself, and it turns out both her and her (ex?)boyfriend hatched money making schemes in the past.

    I think you need to accept the possibility that these sort of backlashes aren’t actually against the gender of “women” and have nothing to do with sexism, but rather are reactions from passionate gamers who detest shysters, liars and activists trying to get video games altered for their own self-gain.

  • Anonymous

    Erm… Ok. I won’t respond to your posts in future if you feel the discussion is over. I don’t think I’ve stalked or been uncivil though, but I’m sorry if you’ve suffered that from others.

  • Anonymous

    OK, and I’m arguing that whether they are legitimate grievances or not is a separate issue to how those grievances are expressed.

    For example, if we are to say they are based entirely on her credibility rather than gender, as you say, that *still doesn’t justify the level of harassment she received*.

    I’ve addressed the idea of ‘fakes’ replying to someone else (I think it’s a ridiculous premise – you either like something or you don’t, and casual gamers are as much gamers as l33t script kiddies.)

    Your last point has been addressed better elsewhere (youtube – Lord Give Me Strength: A Dramatic Reading by MrHateFurnace. He says your views in a silly voice) but it’s an obvious one – WE HAVE OUR OWN GAMES. They’re the same as yours. I bought it, I own it. Unless you had a direct hand in development you have precisely as much say as I do.

  • Anonymous

    Did they specify anyone outside of the development would be veterans, or just devs? Either way, if the kickstarter promise was violated in that regard, then the fault for that lies with her employer, not her.

    If she is a designer, and was asked to design concept art, then yes – it’s valid to criticise her ability to do her job if the designs aren’t to a good standard or not in the appropriate style.

    On community manager moderation ability – that’s a good question. I wondered that myself and I’m a bit torn about it. On the one hand, your job is to liaise with the community. If you’ve managed to divide and antagonise that community, you aren’t suitable for that job.

    Then again, if that community is openly hostile to you from the outset – it doesn’t matter how good your ability to do that job is, or how good of a communicator and facilitator you are. You might have been perfectly suitable, but your ability to do that job is being deliberately compromised by others.

  • http://discord-inc.tumblr.com/ James Fletcher

    I got genuinely furious about the Mighty No. 9 news. There is no reason a person should be treated the way people treated Dina Abou Karam.

    Plus I can’t stand the people who claim that it’s not about her gender, it’s about legitimately about her credentials. There’s no way they would have reacted the way they did if the gender roles were reversed. I still get angry just thinking about it.

    I had not heard about the Depression Quest story, but that is, for lack of a better word, equally depressing. I like how there is this trend among indie games to capture these deeply personal moments in an interactive form. The active element of games allows you to get more invested than you would it you were passively watching or reading something. I hope that it does get on Steam so it can reach a larger audience (I just upvoted it and left a positive comment to show support).

  • Adam Taylor

    They are scum. Simple as that. People who make these horrific comments and insane arguments are sociopaths who have no place in this world.

    A nice desert island somewhere should be filled up with these people… or a very large hole that will be covered up. :p

    What’s sad is that there’s a lot of people who jump on the harassment bandwagon simply because others are doing it. They might not care one way or the other, but they see a lot of people being asshats, so they want to join in. And thanks to the anonymity of the internet, they can get away with it.

    There needs to be serious international laws allowing authorities to track down anyone who makes such comments and arrest them.

  • Anonymous

    Oh, okay. So, you’re totally okay with women being involved with making games, you’re just not okay with women WHO HAVE OPINIONS being involved with making games. Gotcha.

  • LovecraftInBrooklyn

    I have a female friend who just started gaming. I feel less sure about welcoming her into the community now…

  • AllWasWell

    Just throwing in my $0.02 here. I don’t see a problem with your criticisms here (except for all the man-hating stuff, because I don’t think anyone here is saying they hate men – who’s playing the ‘victim’ now?), and I don’t really think that’s the issue. Sending out her personal information and sending her rape threats IS an issue. That is a completely inappropriate and unacceptable way to handle your (not you personally, but the people responsible for this behavior) feelings against how she has handled her job. She may be totally shitty at her job, I don’t know. That’s not the point. The point is receiving actual, legitimate harassment for being bad at her job, which would be a problem for me whether she was a man or a woman. No one should have to deal with that shit. I hear what you’re saying about the forums mostly not doing that, and I assume you are not doing it either, in which case this article isn’t talking about you, is it.

  • Guest

    ‘it is because she is a militant political activist who campaigned to try to get several video games changed’

    Do you even fucking listen to yourself?

  • Anonymous

    Megaman fans are just uncomfortable with a clear non-Megaman fan having an input in this game. This is the spiritual successor of Megaman, one that a lot of people have waited for, and that for years.

    And despite the way you want to spin it, the fan-art was made to inspire the developer to make Beck a female robot (yes I know robots are asexual) and that accompanied with a comment asking so. Again, Megaman always had a male-inspired main character, no sexism there, just a defining characteristic, and now that people have a chance to have a spiritual successor the last thing they would want is for people to come and shake things up (as good as it may sound) and that just to please their personal political views.

    There is a female composer in the team and nobody could gave less of a care. So no the issue has NEVER been about Dina’s gender, if a male had been seen pushing political views on the backers’ page, then happened to be hired as CM with indications that the guy has a say in design and such, AND then people discovered he could care less about Megaman, and yet be the voice between the community and the backers, people would have been angry the same.

    But hey, keep making it look like you people are the self-righteous (fanatical?) good guys in this one :)

  • Axe Armor

    I’m trying to say something reasonable here, but the smugness just makes me angry ANGRY ANGRY

  • alex

    “There’s no way they would have reacted the way they did if the gender roles were reversed.”
    Got any examples to back that up?

  • Axe Armor

    Call has one stage.

  • Vian Lawson

    Interesting that you should bring up the same tired old set of talking points her most neck-beareded detractors do.

    They’ve been more than adequately rebuffed elsewhere, but let’s assume, ad arguendum that they were true. Let’s assume she were not a gamer, but games were her chosen focus as an academic and a feminist. My doctorate is about the correspondence of a 15th century Italian noblewoman. You know what I’m not? Italian. From the fifteenth century. A noblewomen. You know how many academics, over my entire career, have suggested I shouldn’t study what I do? NONE.

    As to keeping the money; that’s how Kickstarter works. She laid out her goals, said precisely what people would get for their pledge, and is in the process of delivering it. Lots of Kickstarters raise more that their target. What’s she supposed to do, give it back?

    And lastly, I think you need to accept that suggesting people need a good raping, making “games” where they are beaten black and blue and unleashing a torrent of misogynist, racist abuse has nothing to do with ethics, and everything to do with reactionary, childish vindictiveness, fear and hatred of women and the mental capacity of a retarded rhesus monkey.

  • Anonymous

    All these trolls are saying the exact same things. Is this all the same guy, or are these all different guys getting their talking points from the same source?

  • Janelle S

    An homage to something doesn’t preclude making changes to the source material.

  • Guest

    . I’m worried a feminist agenda will now permeate the game
    –Don’t jump on this one just yet! What is this response really saying?

    That the guys are misogynists that don’t understand feminism at all.

  • Dehydration

    She’s had plenty of chances to come clean and try to fix the mess, but these days she’s getting worse and worse.

    There was one backer who became popular for voicing out concerns everyone had most calmly and articulately in the community. He eventually gave up trying and wrote a five-thousand word post on how he felt about the situation, what could’ve been done, why everyone’s mad and stuff, as his goodbye post before pulling out his pledge.

    Dina locks the thread and mod edits a majority of the post away, saying that it’s slanderous.

    Now it’s gotten to the point where it seems as if every single thread which either asks questions or mentions Dina in as little as possible a negative light gets locked. Hell, there was even a thread with a fan made gif depicting this whole debacle as an over-the-top TTGL-esque anime-style battle between Dina and the mods versus the rest of the community which even one of the mods liked and said it was perfectly fine.

    Locked.

    Her actions speak louder than anything else. Her actions can damage the game, too. People are asking for refunds left and right, people are getting chargebacks from Concept. Every second she wastes not at least trying to calm the community down is potentially at least a dollar away from the development budget.

  • Scott Zdankiewicz

    The question is: Is that your call to make?

  • Anonymous

    …In all honesty, that kind of mod heavy handedness seems like standard procedure in heated scandals and controversies. I’ve played Eve Online for a long time and they had their…fair share of them. The T20 scandal was the biggest, where a dev was exposed for giving his player account and corp/guild an unfair ingame advantage. When the company found out they didn’t fire him (due to a technicality).

    When this was brought to light to the community by a hacker (rather than the company) fairly predictably and understandably the shit hit the fan.

    What you described is exactly what happened – threads mentioning it get censored, locked, deleted in some cases. Extremely heavy handed. Accusations of lack of transparency and evasiveness directed at the community manager of the time (Kieron). People quitting left right and centre.

    I do agree it’s not a very constructive way of dealing with an angry playerbase. But it’s not an unusual response, either.

  • mangaemi

    ” It seems like she got hired, because of her relationship, to work on a game where another person would have been better suited for the job.”

    But do you work at Comcept? Are kickstarter backers the end all say all to whether someone is qualified or best fitted for a particular job when they don’t work directly for the company? Since when should Kickstarter backers demand a project and all the interpersonal office hiring/firing be up to their discretion??

    She’s a go between from the forums to the company… so not seeing why she has to have a prerequisite of playing MM to have that job – go to any other game company and see if every employee there has been life long gamers… Alot of them probably haven’t.

    If she’s not qualified Comcept will fire her and replace her with someone better, but again that’s not our call to make.. that’s them. We’re on the outside looking in here and it’s not reasonable to assume we know Dina’s true qualifications, capabilities, etc from just what has been rummaged up in the rumor mill online.

  • mangaemi

    Sir/Madam/Whoever you are – that’s the best video I’ve seen all day.

  • mangaemi

    To all the gamerboys that are so up in arms about Dina… here’s 3 realistic ways you can fix this…

    A) Go start your own video game company – where you can decide who you hire and fire.
    B) Take the actual statement given out from the development team at face value and just let it go – no one is out to purposely ruin/infect this game.
    or C) Withdraw AAAAAAAALLLLLLLL of your Kickstarter backing money right now so that it will be YOU that hinders production of the Mighty No 9 and NOT Dina.

    Good lord she’s not even in a position to effect the gameplay. Let Comcept be the true judge of her capabilities in her role – hell you gave them your money because you believed they’d do Mega Man fans right didn’t you??? So stop getting caught up on one single employee and thinking it is a precursor to the entire game being ruined. Talk about making a mountain out of a @$*9)* molehill.

    No one said kickstarter backers had total and final say on every aspect of a project they support.

    Seriously – this is not a big deal. Yet this is the internet and you guys have got to get worked up over something I suppose.

  • César H. Sandoval

    She’s a secondary Character, the whole game was designed around Beck’s unique skill to transform his body, and Roll, Call’s alter-ego in MM games was never playable, Her having a stage in the main game and two Online modes is pretty big all things considered, and was something the majority of fans demanded and put in the game while the KS project was running, so playing as a fem-bot was also in the backers interest.

  • César H. Sandoval

    It does, actually, the moment you change stuff the “homage” part of a project gets dimmer, sometimes it can be small things, sometimes it’s big enough the remake or homage doesn’t even resemble the original at all. changing genders of the characters “just because they can” counts for that too. The point is keeping it “similar” nough is what makes it an homage, instead of a whole different project whatsoever.

    Take Total Recall for example, the remake changed a lot of stuff that fans of the original said was key to the whole film, not even taking place of Mars was something than angered a lot of people, even if the setting was similar to the old version, then you get remakes that look nothing like the original at all, Like Planet of the Apes, Clash of Titans, etc….

    For games, Let’s take tjhe new Tomb Raider as an example next, if they changed Lara Croft for a male when they made it, you can be sure the fans of the original would’ve caused some kind of hell, not to mention even more endless dubm comparisons to the Uncharted series, wich it already has even if they kept Lara as a girl.

    I can’t see the fandom of Games like Metroid, Resident Evil, Silent Hill, Final Fantasy, or others being too happy if the girls who are the main characters of those games were replaced by males in homages or remakes, just because. Part of the appeal of Lara, Samus, Lightning, Heather, etc is that they were women and heroes, just like part of the appeal of Megaman is that he was a little “boy” robot, who was an homage in turn to stuff like AstroBoy, Pinocchio, Kikaider, etc.

  • Anonymous

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXDSfUJBCj0

    That video is how I came to be aware of this Dina Abou Karam situation. I have no further knowledge than what is provided in this video, and I don’t have access to the MN9 forums.

    That said, I don’t think the community is totally in the wrong for distrusting Dina. I would be nervous with a community manager who didn’t know the community she managed. Sure, she could get to know the community, but she says on her twitter that she’s never played a MM game before, so how would she know anything about helping to create (however small her input is,no one can prove) the spiritual successor to the series, let alone managing and getting across the thoughts and feelings of a 25 year old community to the Dev team?

    That combined with her lying in her introduction to the community (by claiming that Megaman X is the best MM game, even though she’s quoted saying on her twitter she’s never played a MM). and her deleting aforementioned tweets soon after locking her twitter, can’t you see how a little bit of unease and malcontent could creep through the community?

    Her feminist ties (if you would call them that) have nothing to do with my distaste for the situation. Steve Harvey is a religious wack-a-do, but he’s still funny. I really don’t think it’s that bad, but I guess other people are imagining worse case scenarios. Still, no matter what she could possibly do, this’ll still be an awesome game. Even if she manages to get all the dialogue and enemies to somehow be female whateverwhosits, it’ll still be a slick game with epic bosses and spectacular stages and ridiculously amazing music

    It’s a side note at this point, but I think you left out parts to the first story. I’m feeling like I very much am missing pieces to the story. A game where you deal with depression sounds fun, though (Ironically…?), I’ll have to check it out.

  • Anonymous

    Can’t say much about the bru-ha-ha on Steam, but as a Mega Man fan, I can’t believe idiots got their undies in a wad over some gender-swapped fan art from a game that hasn’t even been published. Hell, Pixiv, Deviant Art and Rule 34 are FULL of the same kind of thing for Mega Man, both porn and not.

    I didn’t back M#9 because it’s a clone and I’d rather have the real thing. Plus the overall negative vibe against Capcom and the willingness to throw Mega Man under the bus put me off. Now I’m rather glad.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    Men are a plague. This wasn’t “people” harassing these women. IT WAS MEN. STOP ERASING THE AGENTS.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    Men are a disease.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    I’ve been gaming for over 25 years. It is NOT a ‘vocal minority’. I don’t believe that for a second.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    YEP. It’s another of the many ways men ignore women’s concerns about male harassment and male violence.
    NAMETHEPROBLEM. COM

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    Men will say and do anything to maintain their brethren’s reign of abuse and terror over women.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    When will women wake up and realize that men are a plague and have zero respect for them whatsoever, no matter what we say?

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    Not if men want to continue their reign of terror, violence and murder over the entire planet and the women who live on it. Men are a plague. They are the agents of nearly all of the violence and destruction on the planet.
    Meanwhile, women are the world’s largest slave class, based upon our sex.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    That would actually be men in general. Men are violent, entitled and delusional.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    Hmm, odd… I have been a nerd all of my life (I still have my original Pong and Atari 800) and have NEVER been his awful to another person. Ever. Maybe that’s because I am not a violent, entitled male piece of trash.

  • NI MEN HAO-DY TRAMPOLINA

    Our entire planet is pervasive with misogyny. It is not isolated to one subculture. Men are a plague.

    nametheproblem .com

  • Anonymous

    Yes, that video has been how a lot of people found out.

    It lies. It distorted the facts. It showed the tweet of her saying, back during the kickstarter, that she’d never played Mega Man. In order to find that tweet he had to scroll past the tweets of her actually playing Mega Man. By the time she sent out her email about preferring X, she’d beaten X, Mega Man, and Mega Man 2, and had gotten a fair bit further in others.

    the video showed the comment she made on the kickstarter boards saying it would be cool if Call could fight or if Beck was a girl. The videomaker dishonestly didn’t show the next comment she made where she clarified she just meant it would make a nice option, not something to replace regular Beck.

    The video maker implies she just got the job by nepotism, not bringing up her experience in game design, her degree, or anything relevant.

    The guy that made that video had it pointed out to him that there’s seriously misleading omissions in his video. He’s done nothing about it. He’s not interested in truth.

  • Anonymous

    She stated she never played a Mega Man game back during the kickstarter. Then she played several. The person who screencapped the tweet of her saying she’d never played a Mega Man game scrolled right past tweets of her playing Mega Man, and chose to only show people the thing that made her look like a liar that thought she could get the job without playing any Mega Man.

    She’s a bilingual game designer living in Osaka right where she’s needed, and her role is to compile fan input and pass it on. I’m sure there are other people that are bilingual, and in Osaka, and have game development experience, and are willing to work for low pay, AND have played more Mega Man than her. But realistically, she should do fine.

  • Anonymous

    She made a tweet about never playing Mega Man, yes. And the person who screencapped that had to scroll right past the tweets of her playing Mega Man. By the time she started on the job she’d beaten several of the games. When people asked her about the tweet in which she said she’d be doing game development she clarified that comcept’s a small company so since she’s an artist and works for the company, they might from time to time give her some work. But she’s not working on Mighty No. 9.

    The idea that she was a designer was based on a misunderstanding people jumped to after reading her tweets. The idea that she’d never played Mega Man was based on flat-out dishonesty from whoever passed on the old tweet with her saying she lacked experience with the character, ignoring the more recent tweets where she got that experience.

  • Anonymous

    Her “militant campaign to change the game” consisted of her saying it’d be cool if Call was a playable character, or if Beck was a girl. Someone told her they liked Beck’s male design and she replied she just meant that it would be nice to have a “pick gender” option, not get rid of male Beck. The person who shared the screencap of that discussion cut out the part where she said she just meant it as an option.

    The claim that she has zero qualifications is false. She’d done the designs for a game that came out the other year, and has a degree in visual creation from Kyoto University of Art and Design. She’s fluently bilingual, and they needed someone with knowledge of game design that’s bilingual. She played and beat several of the Mega Man games before starting on the project – the person who screencapped the pic of her saying she wasn’t a MM Player scrolled right past the tweets where she started playing Mega Man games to BECOME a MM Player. He screencapped the pic that would make her look like an unqualified liar, while ignoring the ones that showed her going out and enjoying herself playing Mega Man to get ready for her job.

  • Anonymous

    Actually that’s your job. Provide examples of guys getting a job in a minor role in a game and being grilled to this extent, including having people selectively show old comments to make the guy look like he’s unqualified, carefully leaving out the comments that show that he is.

  • Anonymous

    She has passion for the people at comcept who were her friends even before she got the job. She supported the kickstarter. And she has passion for sidescrollers, having worked on them herself. And she went out and bought the Mega Man series and before she started her job she had beaten several and played more. She’s extremely committed to doing the best job she can for comcept, since they’re her friends, and she’s experienced with gameplay development and fluently bilingual, making her well-suited to the role of passing on input from the forums. Obviously it would’ve been nice if she had all that AND had played every last Mega Man too, but she played several and she loved them.

  • Anonymous

    She has no power over deleting the emails. Staffers from 8-4 and comcept who outrank her have shown up on the boards expressing support for her. The idea that she’s hiding things from them is fallacious, as is the idea that she’s locking threads to silence criticism ignores the fact that there are threads specifically devoted to criticism which people are being asked to post in to avoid board clutter (she’s said she would prefer to merge threads but the forum isn’t set up for that).

    The “art discussions” thread was animations someone drew of her as a villain being beaten by the heroic people that dislike her, with anyone that’s expressed support for her being depicted as a “white knight”. That’s not art discussion, that’s just insulting other forum members.

  • Anonymous

    The person who took the screencap of her saying she hadn’t played Mega Man scrolled past the tweets where she was playing Mega Man. She might not have years of experience with the franchise, but by the time she started her job she’d beaten several of the games. She’s fluently bilingual and knows the staff, she wants comcept to succeed as much as anyone else.

    The fanart she drew was her supporting the idea of an option to play as a female Beck, not to replace the male Beck. The person who took the screencap of her saying it would be cool if Beck was female dishonestly didn’t take a screencap of her next post, where she said she just meant as an option, not to replace male Beck.

    Name a male CM that had people go through his old tweets and comments looking for dirt to post on his first day, with people just taking the comments that look bad while editing out the parts that show they’re not anything to get worked up about at all.

  • Anonymous

    Er, what. Men != misogyny any more than men = patriarchy. Misogyny simply means hating women. Suggesting all men hate women is ridiculous. “Men are a plague” is blatant misandry.

    Obviously misogyny isn’t isolated or limited to one subculture, but it’s more predominant, usual and tolerated than more mainstream equivalents.

  • Dehydration

    Still doesn’t make it acceptable. Hopefully the situation dies down, it’s gonna reach a week soon with no end in sight.

  • Janelle S

    I think the distinction between “homage” and “remake” is one that merits further discussion. I would classify the two as similar, but not the same. In particular, I was thinking of the very recent (and possibly applicable) dust-up over the “reimagined” Battlestar Galactica series, and the outrage over changing the gender of Starbuck and Boomer. But that new series itself was so far afield of the original that I don’t know if it works as a good example of what I mean. Perhaps a better example, though less well-known is Michelle Rodriguez’s early film Girlfight, which I would argue is an homage to Rocky.

    Nonetheless, I disagree that the gender of the character is so integral to the story of Mega Man that this represents a betrayal (my word, not yours) of the source material.

    Changing some things, particularly small details that don’t impact the story, “just because” is an interesting way to get a fresh look at source material. Fan art that shows us what Aurora looks like dressed as Phillip raises questions, challenges assumptions, encourages us to go deeper into the experience of the story that is being told by turning some small thing on its head.

  • http://www.bogleech.com/ Bogleech

    ” some people,
    who have read her views and argued with her about them in the past, were
    afraid that she was going to politicize a game that didn’t have any
    agenda.”

    There is nothing about a “feminist” “agenda” that should bother anybody to begin with. There is no reason for anyone to be opposed to more or better female characters in games. I wish a huge massive feminist message WAS inserted into this game. Fuck anybody who disagrees; you have no reason to have a problem with that idea unless you actually do hate and fear women.

  • http://www.bogleech.com/ Bogleech

    sorry, but I have to disagree with the popular “it’s just a really loud minority” defense.

    This is a popular defense of almost every group, but it’s not a realistic one. The vast majority of people ARE horrible. Hateful sentiments ARE mainstream. I have absolutely zero doubt there are AT LEAST TWICE as many racist, misogynistic, homophobic or generally wretched gamers as good, kind, understanding gamers.

    That’s all the more reason for the good ones to stand up and fight, though.

  • César H. Sandoval

    You see, the “No.9″ project is a special case, it was born out of the MM fans outcry for a new game after Capcom completely forgot about the franchise, and Inafune himself has expressed this, as his intention to somehow resurrect MM via this game, of course, we can argue if this is a remake, a reboot, an homage or an spiritual successor., but even if Inafune himself expects the game to become his own thing, the callbacks to previous MM games, the fanbase that was called out to fun this thing, and the staff making it (most of them MM devs) clearly state that this game is intended to be as close to a MM game as possible, down to plot themes, characters and gameplay.

    People are not against female “Megamen”, at least not a lot of them, we had female protagonist in the ZX series before, that games as Pokemon does, lets you shooce the gender before starting the game, and many fans were very happy with that choice, I find it strange that such a mechanic is not in No9 wich is being made by the same people, so you have to wonder, Maybe it is integral to the plot that Beck is male and Call Female, just like back in the day Megaman and Roll had set “genders”.

    And I never said the word “betrayal” in my post, mind you, I only said changing his gender with no other solid reason other than “it doesn’t matter anyway” may upset people, because since the very beggining, the design of the lead character was set in stone as some kind of MM-ish boy robot, is part of the marketing, it’s the very frist pic Inafune drew and used to bring people over and fund the KS. If they were to really change the main now, specially after already having a female playable character in the game, it takes a better argument, because let’s face it, the people who invested in the KS wanted to play as Beck from the first time they saw him, you just don’t go to promise something, ask for money, and they change it without expecting complains.

    Still, we’re arguing over nothing here, Inafune is not changing Beck’s gender, we really are talking about something that is set in stone already and won’t change, if anything, Call’s role in the game may be expanded, wich would be pretty cool, my favorite MM games had multiple characters to choose from.

    Even MMX8 could let you play as 3 females or 3 males for the whole game, Having Call with more stages would do for great replay value.

    I even enjoyey “Rokko-chan” the MM-like game a fan made and have A girl as it’s heroine. A good character is a good character, regardless of the gender, I’m kinda sad that people are getting the idea the MM fanbase is mysoginist just because some guys are still raiding the Dina-case, most of us just want a good game, really, we can care less about sexism, but the promise of No9 is that it will somehow revive what’s left of the MM franchise, so it staying close to it’s roots it’s kinda the selling point.

  • Guest

    I’m a feminist and I love men, judging men on their gender is the same as them judging us on ours. You are just making things harder for feminists by being hateful.

  • Guest

    feminist agenda: making the genders equal! Wow that’s some scary bad shit right there.

  • Rock On

    And you proved that you don’t care about the issues at hand, but only about finding that one something you can twist into your ideal of what you WANT the issues to be.

    “A WOMAN is being accused by hundreds of faceless people of presumably both genders due to the law of averages that they aren’t qualified for their job, and got their job not through networking & having both experience & a passion for the history and ideals of the company…but by having an insider say “You’re hired” without first submitting a resume & qualifications!!”

    “Eh, just toss misogyny around until it sticks somewhere.”

    Way to continue the twisted version of post-70′s feminism movement there.

  • Rock On

    Three days and no answer. That doesn’t bode well for you or your alleged position.

  • Janelle S

    I agree that we are actually arguing over nothing material. I merely wanted to disagree with the assertion that an homage means that everything has to remain the same as the original. I argue that you can pay tribute to something without leaving it intact.

  • Rock On

    What’s this scarecrow-like strawman doing here?

    Is she bilingual? Did she graduate from KUAD? Yes. Does her art style fit the style being used in the game? No.

    It’s nice fan art, though.

    That’s not why the financial investors are questioning her qualifications. They’re questioning her being qualified to _run a site forum and properly express their thoughts to the development team, which is her primary job_.

    Again: They’re questioning her being qualified to _run a site forum and properly express their thoughts to the development team, which is her primary job_.

    So far, her actions have divided the entire investor populace of the locked site, caused people to pull their funding (some of them actually pledged $5000+, not just ‘$20 here, $10 there’ – THAT tells you how dedicated these fans are to MN9 and Inafune), and have generally run the entire forum into the ground. The fact that she herself has been shutting down & banning anyone who has anything to say about her, for good (as “it’ll just devolve”) or for ill (“sorry, saying something bad about us mods is a punishable offense!”) is not beside the point.

    Call is going to already be playable, and fans have NO issue with a female Beck (Remember Aile? DLC of Roll? Tron Bonne? MMX8? No? Then why are you arguing about this again?).

    Also, you missed a MAJOR point in your argument. The head of the MN9 project, Keiji Inafune, promised investors and fans that only those who were _long-time participants of Mega Man_ (which he is credited to being the ‘father’ of, and which MN9 is heavily based) would be involved.

    “…only those who were _long-time participants of Mega Man_ (which is is credited to being the ‘father’ of, and which MN9 is heavily based) would be involved.” – THAT also bared repeating.

    The CM, who is the go-between to the investors & the devs. (including Inafune) and is thereby a part of the project, only started playing Mega Man due to getting/possibly getting the job. THAT’S the point.

    Which makes the investors uneasy. “Does this person know Mega Man? Does this person know why Mega Man is one of the most beloved fictional 8-bit/16-bit characters of the 80′s and 90′s, up there with Pac-Man & Mario? Does this person even understand what the entire point of the MN9 project is about and WHY it came to be? Does she know WHY we throw money at this, and why we’re equally keyed-up over the next Smash Bros game?” She refuses to answer.

    Please reply without the use of strawman arguments.

  • Rock On

    By “dudebros”, you mean “4channers”, right? That IS the typical “code word” for people from that site, I believe.

    Sorry, but the Mighty No.9 forum is LOCKED. Only those who invested in the funding of MN9 have access. There is no 4chan flood. No “dudebros”. Just fans and investors.

    Also, I would like to see your evidence that all the complaints are based on Dina’s gender. I have, multiple times here, pointed out why this is not so. Again, not based on 4chan or whatever, but ONLY on what is occurring WITHIN the MN9 forums.

    As far as gamers only questioning women in gaming in such a way, I present to you:

    Phil Fish.
    Tameem Antoniades.
    Tim Schafer.
    EA in General.

    Of course, I doubt that you’ll look into why I list three men and the ultimate man-club in game development as a counter-point to you.

    Of course, if you really wanna toss around strawman arguments, then tell me this: Why are the financial backers of a video game not allowed to say that they don’t want any social/political/whatever “agendas” in said game, yet various feminist organizations are allowed to say they don’t want organizations advocating “straight-only relations” associated with them?

    Strawman Hypocrisy: Please don’t do that again.

  • Rock On

    Ah, so…playing Tetris, Sonic, Pac Man, Mario, Contra, Zelda, Gunstar Heroes, Street Fighter, Alex Kidd, etc. is the same is playing Mega Man.

    Gotcha.

  • Rock On

    What harassment? There has been no harassment on the MN9 forums. Lots of people asking lots of questions =/= harassment. Garbage being spewed around is happening OUTSIDE the MN9 forums, which these people don’t even have access to as they’re not financial backers.

    If it did constitute harassment, then anyone who ever asked anyone else a question would be arrested & sent to jail. As an example.

  • Rock On

    I…can’t tell if you’re being serious…or if you’re a “dudebro” trying to be funny.

  • Rock On

    Sadly, it doesn’t lie. Read some of my other comments here to see why. The video is disturbingly accurate.

  • Rock On

    No, but it is the right of the people who have donated millions of dollars to the project to be able to ask questions they feel need answered.

  • Anonymous

    Hmm… so she’s beaten 3 Megaman games? I still wouldn’t have someone like that as a first pick, since there are probably 100 MM games (though admittedly there are only really 30-40 games that run the side-scroller format), but it makes it sound a lot better than a flat out lie.I still could have done without the “Megaman X is the best MM” comment, since there’s a lot more to the series than those couple games.

    Well, by default, genderbending Beck would be replacing beck. So I’m not sure if her clarifying “I didn’t mean to replace Beck” matters, cause that’s what she suggested. That aside, isn’t Call going to be playable? Or was this before that?

    The video did bring up her credentials. Did you watch it all the way through? 17:24 he posts a screen shot of her post on why she was hired, and she talks about the things she’s done and what she’s been involved in and a link a game she’s worked on (http://toucharcade.com/2009/12/28/plushed-quirky-and-beautiful/).

    Well… I can’t tell who’s lying. I don’t have access to the forums, and if it’s true that she’s deleted tweets I can’t go and check the source (so people showing screen caps seem more credible than those deleting them, even if that tweet and the forum post were 2 months apart).

    But meh. I don’t really care who she is or who the guy in the video is. I voiced how I felt about it, that did about as much you’d expect on the internet, and I don’t really think it’s too much to get worked up about. I’ll respond if you or anyone else replies, but it’s not really all that important at this point.

  • Rock On

    And you are editing out that she’d never played a Mega Man game until the opportunity to join the company came up/after getting the job.

    I said it before and I’ll say it yet AGAIN: Inafune promised the backers that only long-time Mega Man staffers would be involved in the project. Dina is not a long-time anything to Mega Man. THAT, and how she is currently handling anyone who asks questions of her on the financial backer forums, is why they’re asking if she’s qualified to be part of the team.

    It’s less (as in, not at all) about degrees and languages, but more (as in only) about their personal history with the franchise and their ability to NOT run a password-protected/locked forum into the ground. It’s less (again, not at all) about networking and more (again, as in only) questioning if they got their job without understanding why the fans are passionate about MN9 and only getting the job because of a “bf”.

    The financial backers and fans are demanding a higher standard in hiring, especially the person who acts as their voice to the developers, than degrees and languages BECAUSE they are fans and BECAUSE that is what Keiji Inafune promised to them.

  • Rock On

    Higher standards expected based on statements from Inafune.

  • mangaemi

    Higher standards are great — for the game itself. Backing that kickstarter was for the game and nothing more – it doesn’t give anyone the right to demand how Comcept runs their inner-office affairs or how they run a forum.

    One might argue that most of the people angry with this feel that their nostalgia-love of MM entitles them to have complete say in every aspect of this project and even more so in how Comcept is run day-to-day. That is not the case at all.

    If anything, the anger and outcry will have an opposite effect… Comcept could feel forced to *not* fire her because if they did all these angry forum posters would see how easy it is to manipulate and bring change to that company. Then they’ll just find something else to get huffy about, Comcept will change it and it will keep happening and that whole verbiage about “too many cooks spoil the broth” — THEN the game will suck.

    If everyone was *this* doubtful about the game’s success.. why did they even support it? One little bump in the road with an employee that doesn’t actually code/develop the game and you’d think the whole project was doomed. With 3mil in backings clearly it was based off the love of the final product – not some forum manager position.

  • Rock On

    I’m also enjoying how the CM, Dina, has is completely mis-using her authority. Case in point:

    ‘Financial Backer “Kilim”:

    Have any higher ups and Comcept actually weighed in on our current situation? Whatever “side” we’re on I’m sure we can all agree that the response has been more than lacking.

    Just so we’re clear on what I mean by higher ups, I mean (Posts image on a clip of one of the promises/statements regarding the development of MN9, specifically, “Every aspect of development–art, level design, music, programming, etc.–is being handled by veteran Japanese game creators with extensive experience in the genre, and with Mega Man in particular, all the way up to and including Keiji Inafune himself! Backers will have unprecedented access to seeing this team at work through blogs, podcasts, videos, concept art–the works!”‘

    The response:

    Dina:

    ‘Hello, Official word from Comcept here!
    comcept is aware of any and all things on these forum, thank you!
    As a representative of comcept, this constitutes an official statement :)’

    Thread Locked.

  • Anonymous

    - Well since she deleted her tweets there is no telling now if what you are saying is true or not… when we have clear pics of those tweets where she says she hadn’t played it… She kinda dig her own grave on this one :/

    - Nope, the fanart WAS for making Beck a female robot, was there and saw the comment and the fan art, she was pushing was Beck being female.

    - You would be surprised how careful Phil Fish has to be with his Twitter now… Gamers can be a hateful bunch whether you are a boy or a girl.

  • Anonymous

    Stay mad :^)

  • RoscoePaterson

    I’d like to add something here that I just confirmed while fact checking:

    The composer for Mighty Number 9 is a woman, and nobody in the community has a problem with her. No harassment, no threats, no complaints. Lends an awful lot of credence to the idea Dina’s detractors have a problem with her performance and qualifications and not with her gender.

  • Scott Zdankiewicz

    That certainly implies a lack of trust in the developers you’ve given money to.

  • Anonymous

    Actually, she didn’t delete her tweets about actually playing the game. They’re still there. But here, screencapped:

    http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2r23fvp&s=5#.UrDLIOKqTJh

    The person that wanted to show everyone that she’d never played a Mega Man game in her life scrolled right past the tweets where she was playing Mega Man.

    She reacted badly by deleting anything, but people were taking old tweets and passing them around saying she wasn’t a player while ignoring the more recent ones about her starting to play.

    Just like how the guy who showed us her fanart of female Beck left out that in her next post, after someone said they liked the male Beck design, she clarified she didn’t want to get rid of male Beck just have a gender swap possibility.

    http://oi41.tinypic.com/qohnae.jpg

    It’s a bit confusing without context, but they were talking about an option for the player to choose the character’s gender, like with Shovel Knight.

  • Anonymous

    It would help if you had specified what you were calling a strawman. It’s a matter of record that two of the main complaints about her have been that she never played the games and wanted to change Beck’s gender. Both misconceptions were due to dishonesty within the community; someone went through her old statements and screencapped pieces that gave the wrong impression, carefully leaving out her subsequent comments about playing the games and only wanting a female-Beck option, not to get rid of male back. Pointing out that often-repeated complaints were baseless is not attacking a strawman. And while her art style doesn’t match the game, she’s not working on game development. The idea that she was a developer for the game got started when people started looking through her old tweets and jumped to conclusions based on short statements she made that nobody knew the context of. Comcept is a small startup, she’s working there as a Community Moderator, but she has experience as an artist. They indicated they may give her art projects from time to time, but they’re not using her as a designer for Mighty No. 9.

    Running the forum is a job divided up between several people, with 8-4 LTD playing a major role. Her own major role is to collect feedback on game design and pass it on to comcept.

    People are indeed questioning her ability to do so. There is no way for anyone to prove that they can do a job like that except by doing it, and game development has not yet reached the stage where she’s given an opportunity. Nobody has provided a realistic argument as to why she would be unable to pass on particularly popular fan input.

    Some backers have indeed claimed to have pulled thousands of dollars of funding. It’s possible they were being truthful. But those screencaps were posted in a thread where someone posted tweets from Dina saying she was quitting her job, which turned out to be a shoop. And where someone posted a thread allowing everyone on that site to vote, while posting the same poll in the Mighty No. 9 forums pretending it was just backers voting in the poll. Honesty is not the strong suit of the people who were participating in that thread.

    And the fact that people would say they were pulling thousands of dollars from the project over a CM does indeed indicate exactly how dedicated those fans are to MN9 and Inafune: Zero dedication whatsoever. The Community Moderator position was never something we were promised. We were promised polls, surveys, and contests. Those things will still happen. The community moderator is something we were given in addition to what we were promised. If someone will pull their funding because they were given an additional way to give input, but they don’t like it, and they chose to ignore that all the promised ways of giving input are still there, then that’s absolutely not a sign of dedication.

    There are threads that exist specifically for complaints and questions. When someone makes a new thread instead of using those, since they don’t have a merge thread option the threads are locked and people are asked to use the existing threads. People get banned when they start using flat-out insults toward her or the other posters. That’s not unusual on any board. You can say you don’t trust her or you think she’s ruining the game. It won’t get you banned, there’s plenty of posts like that there. You start telling people to back out then illegally pirate the game, or start saying everyone that disagrees with you that she’s ruining things is just a white knight? Yeah, that’ll get you banned.

    Regarding Inafune’s promise, here’s what was actually said: “Every aspect of development—art, level design, music, programming, etc.—is being handled by veteran Japanese game creators with extensive experience in the genre, and with Mega Man in particular, all the way up to and including the project’s leader, Keiji Inafune himself!”

    And every aspect of development is indeed being handled by veteran game creators. Dina is not working on game development. Comcept had promised people would have input through polls, surveys, and contests. In addition to that they decided to hire a Community Manager to pass on input to the developers. She is not a developer. It would not make sense to assign a veteran game creator to be a glorified moderator with the job of passing on input to the actual game creators. You wouldn’t fine a veteran game creator willing to do such a low-rank job for low pay.

    She hasn’t “refused to answer” the question of why people care about the project, she’s said that she understands it’s a big deal to people because they’re passionate about the game. And she knows the people who work at the company, and wants to see them do well, so even though she’s a relative newcomer to Mega Man (putting aside that she played and beat X years ago), there’s no reason to think she won’t be passionately trying to make this the best game possible. Meanwhile, nobody has been able to explain why they think she’d be unable to do the job of passing on game design input. One of the strengths of the franchise is that it’s been beautifully easy to understand. It’s Rock Paper Scissors turned into a shooter. It’s a genre-definer. If you know 2-D platformers, you can understand Mega Man after playing a few of the games. Which she’s done.

    For the record the forums have a board for discussing the games and a board for discussing other matters like Dina’s appointment. And the board for actually discussing the games?

    Things are going just fine there.

  • Anonymous

    Mark MacDonald from 8-4 LTD and Ben Judd from comcept also stepped in to confirm they’re aware of people’s concerns but have faith in her, and have asked people to just give her a chance to do her job. The idea that she’s hiding anything is groundless. Kilim had been informed of this and had seen the threads where other staffers had confirmed they were aware, but made a new thread asking for still-more confirmation anyway. So it got locked, for being another thread asking for confirmation that had already been given.

  • Anonymous

    Those do all sound like legitimate complaints. But they’re not true. A few unscrupulous people tricked other fans, and now there’s a large number of people convinced they have legitimate reason for concern when they really don’t.

    Dina knows people who are on staff there, yes. That’s how she knew about the job opening. They needed someone bilingual, and since she was friends with staff there they knew they had no problem understanding her Japanese. She also has a degree in visual creation from Kyoto University of Art and Design, and experience in professional game design. She got checked out by comcept, and Inafune himself signed off on her. Yeah, the small startup company needed someone that could speak English and Japanese and went with someone they knew personally. That’s not really a cause for concern by itself.

    The idea that she’s trying to “push an agenda” on the game comes from a screencap someone made of what she said during the kickstarter, where she suggested it’d be cool to play as Call or if Beck was a girl. The thing is, the person who screencapped that left out the next thing she said, where she clarified she just meat it’d be a cool option for the game to have, not that she wanted to get rid of male Beck. Lots of games let you pick the gender of your character. It turns out this is something comcept had actually considered, but decided would probably cost too much.

    The idea that she’d never played the games comes from, well, a tweet she made during the kickstarter, saying she’d never played the games. Pretty damning. The thing is, the person who screencapped that scrolled right past the tweets where she was playing Mega Man. Before she started the job she’d beaten several of the games and played a good bit of still more. She hasn’t played every last one of the games, but it doesn’t seem possible that anyone will come up with a suggestion she’ll be unable to comprehend because she hasn’t played and beaten every last one of the games.

    The community wants her to leave because a handful of people in the community decided she needed to go, and decided to get everyone else on their side by using deception.

  • Anonymous

    Yes, because she totally did not have an incentive to play them with the prospect of being hired? It doesn’t change the fact that she is not genuine, even more showed up when she had the galls to tell Megaman X was the best when she was still a newbie to the series. She is fraud, that simple.

    We do agree that she made a mistake by deleting those tweets, if anything this give the impression that worse things could have been hidden in there, but hey.

    Good. Seems like at least she is not that radical a feminist, that’s good, we could use more of those. I disagree with her notion of this being an issue at all, but I can understand the (wrong) feeling.
    Again, there is a context here, Megaman always featured a male character, and what people want right now is more of the same, not innovation. I could see a female main character in future iterations though, and I would be comfortable with a choice between male and female version.

    Still this does not change the fact that she is a ill-fitted for the CM position, had no genuine feeling toward the franchise, got in through relations instead of credentials, AND lied several times to the community (megaman X, bf = best friend gotta think people are stupid enough to believe that,.not having political agendas).

    And that her fan-arts are atrocious.

  • Anonymous

    Sure it’d be nice if she played more of the games. But we’ve got a bilingual Community Manager with experience in game design, that lives right by their offices in Osaka, that knows staff members personally, and played through several of the games.

    If he mentioned her credentials I admit I forgot, but it’s pretty dishonest of him to say she only got the job by sleeping her way in while ignoring that her job is to collect things people say in English and pass it on to people that speak Japanese, and the fact that she’s friends with these people (and has a degree from a Japanese university) is a good indicator that her Japanese is solid.

    She did get scared and delete a couple of tweets when she saw people were using them dishonestly. It was stupid of her, sure. They were screencapped anyway. But you can still see her more recent tweets where she started playing Mega Man games before she started her new job. She didn’t delete those. If you don’t want to go look for them, here http://oi39.tinypic.com/2r23fvp.jpg

    As for the changing Beck’s gender thing, she meant it’d be nice if there was an option for playing as a female Beck, not that the game shouldn’t have male Beck. Sort of like how you can make Shepard a girl in Mass Effect. They get into talking about how Shovel Knight was doing it, but it’s a serious pain to scroll back in the kickstarter thread to find the stuff from September. Here’s the next post she made, after someone said they liked male Beck. She just wanted an option to play as a girl, that’s all. Like what the Shovel Knight backers got. http://oi41.tinypic.com/qohnae.jpg

    This really should never have been an issue. She might not be the most ideal Community Manager possible, but there’s nothing to indicate she can’t do the job of passing on fan-input. This only became an issue because a couple people decided they really didn’t like her, and used dishonest means to try and get other people on their side.

  • Blindsided

    I think that’s it exactly. Everyone who is rejected by others isn’t necessarily misunderstood. Sometimes people understand them very well, and that’s where the problem is for them.

  • Anonymous

    “And you are editing out that she’d never played a Mega Man game until the opportunity to join the company came up/after getting the job.”

    No dishonesty was intended. I’ve said several times here (not in that post) that she started playing the games to go apply for the job. She’s relatively young, Mega Man was mostly before her time, but she started playing it and loved it. Why does it matter if she played the games several years ago or just recently? Her job is to pass fan input on to the designers. What could someone suggest that she’d only understand if she played Mega Man 2 back in 1987 as opposed to 2013?

    Inafune promised that game development would be handled by veterans. The programing, the design, the music. She’s doing none of that. They’re going to do polls, surveys, and contests. She’s there to be someone bilingual that can see if people want those polls/surveys/contests tweaked a bit, and if there’s anything else people really want to pass on. Good luck finding a well experienced veteran designer that’s bilingual and willing to do that low-paying thankless job. It’s not development, it’s providing backers with an extra way to give input that we weren’t promised originally.

  • David T.

    Indeed the case of Depression Quest is a sad one, and should be considered a definite case of geek-culture misogyny. However, as someone who has followed the Mighty No. 9 drama for quite some type, it’s become apparent that while there was definite anti-feminist sentiment amongst those feeling appalled by Dina at the start, and still is… quite a few deal more people feel she just isn’t qualified for the job of community manager due to openly lying on a several subjects- creating distrust is not a good way to be a community manager. Further, the latter part of detractors have insisted that other women take her post if 8-4 or Comcept truly feel that criticism on her is only there because she’s a woman.

    I mean, the case COULD be made that her lies wouldn’t have come to light if the angsty anti-feminists didn’t go digging in her Twitter, but the facts are still there that she lied about stuff she really should have been open on.

    Personally I feel that she hasn’t done anything to warrant her firing, but it is suspicious she’d lie about simple stuff.

  • Anonymous

    Okay, she had incentive to play them.

    And?

    Doesn’t change that she played them, or that she thought they were fun.

    Yes, she knows the staff, and had been going out drinking with them well before she got this job. No, she doesn’t have years of experience with Mega Man. The first cancels out the second. Even if she secretly disliked the games (and that’s paranoia), she wants her friends to do well, and is going to do everything she can to make the game succeed. Hell, her future in the company is riding on its success, she’s hardly going to sabotage herself by half-assing this.

    Her job is to take fan input on game design and relay it to the actual developers.

    Tell me some fan input on game design that she could only relay to the developers if she was a passionate fan who had played the games years ago.

    Give me a legitimate reason to be concerned as a backer. I need someone I know speaks Japanese to turn to the developers and say “they want a sixth poll option”. What are we going to come up with that she’d only understand if she was a veteran player, and not someone that only beat some games recently? Seriously dude, what?

  • Anonymous

    Which parts exactly? Some of it is stuff she said in the members-only forums, but she still has her tweets where she was playing classic Mega Man and you can still find the kickstarter thread where she said back in September that she’d like playable Call or female Beck, then clarified she just meant female Beck as an option, not to get rid of male Beck.

  • David T.

    Yeah people who disagree with your personal ideals should definitely be thrown in jail! They’re definitely on the same level as rapists and murderers! We shouldn’t be educating them, we should be imprisoning them!

    smh

  • Anonymous

    Why would Inafune do that with no guarantee that people wouldn’t pull this crap again? He’s got a bilingual staffer with experience in game design in charge of reading comments in English about game design then passing them on. There’s nothing to suggest she can’t do that job, and she was friends with the staff there before even getting hired.

    As for the “lying,” a lot of people saw an old tweet where she said she hadn’t played Mega Man before, and from that they concluded that she was a liar since her first email was about preferring X to Mega Man. But the person who found that old tweet and screencapped it scrolled right past tweets of her playing classic Mega Man. Back during the kickstarter she hadn’t played classic Mega Man, when she sent out her email she’d beaten X, Mega Man, and Mega Man 2, and was pretty far into Mega Man 4 and 6. She wasn’t lying, she was speaking as someone that honestly had played the games.

  • Anonymous

    Their questions were answered. Mark MacDonald from 8-4 LTD and Ben Judd from comcept both went into the forums, saw the complaints, and said that while they understand that some people feel frustrated they feel confident Dina can do the job and want people to give her a chance to do her thing.

  • David T.

    Fair enough, I’ve gotten my updates on the situation from fairly… biased sources so I can understand how I was misinformed here.

  • Anonymous

    “People feel like the inclusion of a mechanic like Force Armor to enhance the game”.

    Have fun with that and explaining how and why if you haven’t played Megaman X5. Or explaining some aspect of the Part System some players would like to be implemented in MN9.

    Those are things any newbie can see, but only people who have spent enough time with the game can appreciate how they fit in the different iterations of the franchise and if those could be a good fit for MN9.

    And there is the possibility she won’t have the background to get some key point the backers who actually know of those mechanics will discuss and then translate them badly to the team.

    I wouldn’t want someone who doesn’t know about frame data to handle the communication between the players of a 2d fighting game and the dev team. Any idiot can see the frame data numbers but it takes mastery to comprehend what they represent and how they interact.

    I would be worried. You should be too.

    Also goog job on ignoring the whole part about her lying, it’s quite a big deal you know…

  • Anonymous

    I’d argue with the “played through several of the games” part of that first paragraph. We only know she’s for sure played/beat 3 MM games by the time she was hired. And, the Kickstarter does say:

    “Every aspect of development–art, level design, music, programming, etc.–is being handled by veteran Japanese game creators with extensive experience in the genre, and with Mega Man in particular”

    And, sure, she isn’t a head developer person, but she is participating in it’s development with designs and apparently various other smaller tasks. It’s a minor thing I guess, but I kind of thought that everyone working on this project would at very least be well-versed in Megaman. Don’t need to have created multiple Megaman games or have played every game, just played more than a single digit number. It is good, her bilingual credentials, but it’s not like people who speak english and japanese are scarce. Not common, of course, and maybe she was the only one available, but still.

    Dishonest? Well, it does sorta sound like Nepotism. She says she knew all of the people in the dev team, and she knows Keiji well enough that he jokes with her apparently about how she got the job because of the people she knew. I don’t really have too much of a problem with Nepotism if the person hired can perform competently. It looks like she can, so I guess it’s not too bad. But still, can’t help but feel her connections eased her way

    The screencaps are still here, but still. It just feels really shady for someone to start going and deleting tweets. I mean, I’ve never been so paniced that I tried to delete the things I said that people were pointing to (granted I’ve never been quite so big a target). That she deleted specific tweets is proof that she was trying to bury it, paniced or not.

    Well, if she had played Megaman games, she could have suggested a player mechanic ala ZX/ZXA, where at the start you pick between alternative characters (one male, one female) and actually get a unique story and plot from each. That would be much more fitting, since Mass Effect’s purpose was player immersion, and having a fully customizable character was key to that. There is no “gender swapped Sheperd”, there’s “Sheperd”, whether the avatar be male or female it’s up to the player to decide who that is and their personality. On the other hand, “Beck” is going to be a character, with set actions and a set personality. Genderswapping him is weird, and like I said earlier, the ZX/ZXA route would be much more natural (picking between two characters rather than suddenly switching ones gender sometimes). That said, I don’t mind genderswaps, they can be fun, but for a game like this it’s weird.

    “Should never have been an issue”. Well, you have to understand. Since 2010 MM fans have been getting shitted on, and we haven’t really gotten anything since 2007 (I don’t count MM 9/10, they feel like beating a dead horse, offering nothing new to anything and trying to make a bit of bank off an outdated/retro style). We got two games cancelled in a row (MMU and MML3 (While being told it’s cause we didn’t care enough)) followed by no MegaMan in the UMVC3 (Zero was nice, but the Blue Bomber was SORELY missed), followed still by the in-ridiculous-bad-timed joke of “Bad Box Art Megaman” in SFxT.

    This is forgetting even fans who have been paitiently waiting for updates to their favorite series; MMX fans have been begging and pleading for MMX9 for god knows how long, and I personally have been waiting hopefully for a ZXA followup. And, do you remember what we got for the Blue Bombers 25th aniversery last year…? A god damn fan game with the Capcom logo slapped on it. You have to understand. This, Mighty Number 9, THIS IS IT for a lot of people. MM is apparently dead to Capcom, so we have THIS. It needs to go just right, it NEEDS to. Any other game the MM community would have been fine. But not this one. This needs to be perfect. And can you imagine having this community manager, voicing all of your hopes and dreams to the people who can make them all come true, appear shady and unversed in what has to go right… wouldn’t you be nervous? Wouldn’t you do what you could to make sure the game that’s the culmination of all you’ve waited for went off without a hitch?

    That’s how I see it.

  • Anonymous

    No, seriously, she’s not a developer. That’s not what a developer IS. A developer is someone that makes the designs, the coding, the music.

    Comcept has things set up so we’ll get polls, contests, and surveys to give our input. That’s what we were promised. Then they went the extra mile because they saw how passionate we were and hired a community manager as well, something not in the original deal. Her job is to look at what we’re saying and let comcept know if there’s some simple but popular ideas we could put in, or if there’s a problem with one of the polls or something. That’s seriously it. We’ve only got a little input, and she’s in charge of letting us tweak it a little. To use an analogy someone offered, it’s like comcept is buying a house and is letting us pick between a red a blue or a green a toaster, and she’s in charge of letting them know we’d like to include a yellow one in the vote too. She’s just not in a position to significantly hurt this.

    And seriously , “Nepotism” is something to be concerned about when the CEO hands a top job in the company to his nephew that’s fresh out of college instead of to a 40 year company vet. That’s not what happened here. They needed someone with a little game design experience that could speak English, and a few people at the company sometimes hung out with a foreign girl that spoke fluent Japanese. Calling it nepotism that some people at a little startup company went “well what about Dina? She’s bilingual, ask her to come in and interview” is really overstating things.

    You could say it was “shady” for her to delete the tweets, but come on. Some friends asked her to come work at their business, she got the job because the job pretty much was “can you game? And can you speak the two languages you clearly speak?” she started playing through the games in preparation for her job, woke up for her first day on the job expecting questions like “What’s Inafune really like?” or “What’s it like being a foreigner in Osaka?” and instead saw people selectively using her tweets to imply she was less qualified than she actually was. She panicked. She shouldn’t have done that, sure, but come on. You don’t need to be a fundamentally dishonest person to panic and screw up when you find out people are deceitfully distorting your old tweets to try to run a smear campaign and get you fired on your first day of a new job.

    The notion of playing as a female Beck may seem weird, but it’s one Comcept had actually been thinking about according to what 8-4 let us know. Nothing to do with Dina. They decided that while it might be good PR, there’s so much going to be done with Beck in the game that the budget probably just doesn’t have room to do an alternate version.

    You don’t need to tell me how much Mega Man fans have been shat on, I’ve been there through all of it, believe me. And I do totally get that we’ve been so burned so often we start screaming just at the sight of a box of matches. But this is not a cause for concern. It’s just not. Her job is to read some posts in English then turn around to people she talks to all the time and pass on what we said. Nothing we can suggest is going to be so esoteric that she won’t be able to grasp just because she’s newer to the franchise than some of us have been. We want what’s best for the company, and making Inafune fire someone popular in the office on her first week on the job, before she’s even had a chance to do the main part of her job, right before Christmas, based largely on misunderstandings that were aggravated by a craptastic forum that makes it hard to find where she already addressed their concerns… I mean yeesh. That’s not the Mega Man fandom I know and love.

  • Anonymous

    I didn’t ignore the claims she’d lied. People said she lied about playing the games. She didn’t. The people that went through her tweets and found the tweet of her saying she wasn’t a MM Player were the ones that were dishonest, because they ignored the more recent tweets where she played to get ready for her new job.
    Okay, so your example is “People feel like the inclusion of a mechanic like Force Armor to enhance the game”

    So she reads that, and then she turns to the guys from Japan and says “They feel like the inclusion of a mechanic like the Force Armor to enhance the game. Or the Part System some players would like to be implemented in MN9″. Only in Japanese.

    And if we come up with something really popular she doesn’t understand, you know what she can do? She can turn to the other people there and say “I can’t understand the gameplay dynamic but let me translate this for you.”

    The thing is, she’s more input than we were promised originally. They told us we’d get polls, surveys, and contests. Having someone there to try and pass on a little bit more? We weren’t promised that. They went the extra mile by giving us a CM, and in return people have been asking the company to fire a friend right before Christmas, because we think she’s too stupid to pass on what we say, and because of old things she said that people distorted to make her look bad.

  • Carlos Rodriguez

    I am a backer for Mighty N9 and the problem began in the forums because Dina expressed his desire to influence managers to change the designs in Mighty as a woman, she wished there was a strong female image, and from there it was all a rush, she repeatedly manifesto be responsible for the designs of the characters and of ecenarios and even was defined as a feminist and I was going to do everything possible to bring about the changes she wanted, beyond all problem arose personally dismiss a person who first presented the way Dina was presented not it must be taken seriously and already have a second Mighty Heroin Call that each Backers support from day one. My view is that Dina should not be fired because of their sexual or anything, but by definition have created controversy and anger to Backers

  • The Bechtloff
  • Anonymous

    In that they’re all games…?
    Yes…

  • Anonymous

    “Some members of the Mighty No. 9 backer community took this to mean that Dina was a corrupting feminist influence on the game, delved into her personal life, and demanded that she be fired and that they be given refunds.”

    I didn’t specify where the harassment came from in my comment. Just that she received it.

  • Anonymous

    Re: incentive. It’s perfectly legitimate (and a really good idea) to play the games to get a good idea of the project or company you’ll be involved in.

    I played a LOT of GTA 4 (and enjoyed it) before an interview with Rockstar but the primary incentive was – I wanted to be able to talk in depth and have good knowledge about their most recent title (at the time).

    I don’t think that made me a fraud.

    (As a side note, while I don’t think your comment is invalid in context, as you’re talking about a specific spiritual successor:

    “what people want right now is more of the same, not innovation.”

    to me that’s everything wrong with the games industry right now. and I’m not talking about gender issues.)

  • Anonymous

    Why?

  • Anonymous

    She obviously lied about being a Megaman fan, you can try to spin that around as much as you want, the tweets are here to show it when all you have to show is tweets showing she is more of an opportunist than a Megaman fan AND your trust in her…. so yeah.

    OOhhhh, so in the end what we have is a glorified translator?… Or worse, someone who is just going to parrot what people who actually know shit about Megaman’s gameplay say?

    You really, really think she is not going to have any input in the making of this game (or should I say you guys want us that bad to believe this ridiculous claim). Of course she will have an impact, she is not just a translator, as was shown by them asking her for input on enemy design.

    And now we have someone who doesn’t know shit about the intricate aspect of the franchise giving input. If someone who never play KoF (my personal favorite franchise) started to get in and affect things, I would go Berserk! Because there are SOOOO many things that this guy could change that would ruin the game (lol let’s put instant-kills, it will please the mainstream audience). So I feel for the Megaman franchise right now, a newb is going to affect the game they waited for so long.

    Frankly, I would have preferred they went with polls, surveys, and stuffs, if it was to end up with a glorified translator, or worse a clueless parrot. At least we know the communication would have been a direct link between people who understand the franchise and its gameplay.

    Finally, you seem A LOT more concerned about defending her position than the well-being of the game/project… If that wasn’t the case I doubt you would be that comfortable with the fact that she will end up being the weak link in the chain between the devs and the backers.

  • Guest

    As a backer I certainly don’t see the problem with a gender change Beck. Why would it bother you when you can just ignore the existence of the other sprite. If you could pick between Lara Croft and Nathan Drake in a Tomb Raider game I would not give less of a shit.

  • Guest

    The problem I have with this is that the original post that introduced Dina to the community is completely inoffensive. There is NO WAY that people got upset about anything other than the fan art (which is actually what it was described as) of Beck as a woman. Then they went digging around for ways to discredit her.

  • Anonymous

    “BECAUSE that is what Keiji Inafune promised to them.”

    If he promised them veteran developers, he’s still keeping that promise as a community manager isn’t a dev.

    If not, then surely the associated rage at that broken promise should be directed at Keiji Inafune, rather than Dina Abou Karam, no?

  • Guest

    I did fund the game and I think the backlash against Dina is misogynist bullshit.

  • Charles

    I think for male it’s the latter, and for female, the former, which explains the statement this male harasser ignorantly made.

  • Michael Taylor

    I stumbled upon this site through a Mighty No 9 Google search and was amazed to see the lack of understanding on the ENTIRE issue. It seems the other half of the story was left out to prove a point. Twitter originally became a target to validate any professional experience working with this genre. I understand she is being attacked for being a woman and wanting to level the playing field of gender. That is a sad thing to see. If you take a look at her now deleted Twitter posts which you can find in videos on the internet she clearly states she has no experience with a Mega Man game which Mighty No 9 is based off of. She also very clearly shares in another post that she is excited to be given the ability to make robots for the game. Then in a later Twitter post lies horribly by saying Mega Man X is her favorite Mega Man game but had previously said she has no experience with Mega Man games. This is why most of the people who do have access to the forum from backing just like myself have a issue with her as a “community manager”. A community manager is only supposed to provide feedback to a studio form it’s fans and get involved in community events. The community manager can’t share every single idea in most cases there is just too much data but that manager uses his or hers experience with that game or it’s genre to decide what developers can focus on. She just doesn’t fit the bill and the only reason she has a job there is because she has many friends who work there and even her boyfriend is employed there. Now the most disturbing part is she admits this as all being true in a post on the forums section of the site. Anyone looking for this information can find it on the forum provided you were a backer and have been sent access to the forum or you can watch videos with all of this information be presented by backers.

  • Guest

    The guy who looked through her twitter apparently scrolled past plenty of posts where she said she was playing the mega-man games and enjoying them, strange that!

  • Anonymous

    The outlandish claim is the one that says men and women are treated equally in the games industry.

  • Anonymous

    If you looked at her twitter yourself instead of castigating others for not doing so, you would have seen her playing Classic Mega Man on it. Yes, back during the kickstarter she hadn’t played it, and said so. Then she started playing it. By the time she had started her job she had played and beaten several of the games. She didn’t lie, the person who found her old tweet about not playing the games lied by scrolling right past the tweets of her playing Classic Mega Man, pretending not to see them. http://oi39.tinypic.com/2r23fvp.jpg

    She does admit she knew people at the company beforehand, yes. That doesn’t make her qualifications vanish. Her job is to take backers input on gameplay design, given in Japanese and English, and pass them on in Japanese and English. She’s bilingual, she has a degree in visual creation from Kyoto University of Art and Design, and she has prior experience in game design.

    Sadly, you were deceived.

  • Anonymous

    No, not enough said there.

    The video deceives by omitting facts, in an attempt to trick people such as yourself, creating fear and panic where it’s not warranted. It’s unfortunate that you were misled. For example, The videomaker went searched her old tweets and found one she made during
    the kickstarter campaign, in which she stated she was supporting the campaign but wasn’t a Mega Man player herself. Which does sound scary, what sort of woman takes a job like this without even playing Mega Man? The deception was that in order to find that old tweet, the videomaker had to scroll past and ignore more recent tweets where she started downloading the games from the Nintendo e-store and playing them so she’d be prepared if she got this job. http://oi39.tinypic.com/2r23fvp.jpg That’s a big thing to leave out.

    The videomaker also found a comment she posted during the kickstarter saying it would be cool if Call were playable or if Beck was a girl. The videomaker scares people into thinking she’s pushing an agenda to change the main character’s gender. But he’s dishonest – the very next thing she said in the kickstarter comments was that she just wanted an option to play as a female Beck, not to replace the male one. http://oi43.tinypic.com/hsomc8.jpg

    As a matter of fact, backers were informed a few days ago that comcept themselves had considered that as a possible stretch goal during the kickstarter, but it just would’ve been too costly.

    The videomaker claims she’s a designer on the game. She’s not. She’s a designer for comcept, but not on the game. The fact that she’s not a designer on the game has been confirmed repeatedly with staff. Comcept’s a poor startup, and thus they were pleased that their new Community Manager is also an artist since they could sometimes give her design work to polish her skills. But she is not doing design work for this.

    She does know people in the company, which doesn’t change the fact that her job is to read things in English and Japanese and then pass them on in English and Japanese, that she has a degree in visual creation from Kyoto University of Art and Design, or that she has personal experience in game design.

    The videomaker alleges she will push an agenda on the game. Mark MacDonald from 8-4 LTD (who are working with comcept on this) and Ben Judd from comcept have confirmed this is a preposterous idea. The new girl with an extremely minor job will not be taking over the company founder’s favorite project.

    The videomaker’s had these factual omissions pointed out to him and has done nothing about it.

  • Anonymous

    It’s unfortunate so many people have been misled by that video. It dishonestly omitted facts in an attempt to scare people such as yourself into thinking something was wrong, hurting the game. The videomaker went back through her tweets and found one during the kickstarter campaign in which she said she was supporting Mighty No. 5 even though she wasn’t a Mega Man player. In order to find that tweet the videomaker had to scroll past tweets in which Dina was playing Classic Mega Man in preparation for applying for the new job. http://oi39.tinypic.com/2r23fvp.jpg When she came on board she had beaten X, Mega Man, and Mega Man 2, and had made good headway with others.

    The videomaker also scared people into thinking Dina would attempt to change Beck into a girl, based on a message she made on the kickstarter boards in September. What he neglected to post was her next message, in which she said she just wanted it as an option, not to remove the male Beck design. http://oi43.tinypic.com/hsomc8.jpg In the past couple days we actually had word that comcept had considered the idea themselves during the kickstarter, before she was an employee, but had deemed the gender option too costly.

    The videomaker alleges that she just used her connections to get a job and didn’t have the qualifications needed. She responded to that, confirming that she did know people at the company beforehand and was part of their social circle, but that just meant she found out about the job opening easily. She still needed to be qualified, and was interviewed, including by Inafune himself. She’s functionally bilingual, which is the main qualification since she needs to read comments made in two languages and pass them on to others in two languages. She has experience in game development, and a degree in visual creation from Kyoto University of Art and Design. We’re received word from Mark MacDonald of 8-4 LTD and Ben Judd from comcept that she will not be able to push any “agenda” on the game, and she’s not a designer on the game, another falsehood the videomaker pushed using half-truths. She’s indicated that comcept said that since she’s a designer they may have design work for her while she’s working there, but she’s not doing any for Mighty No. 9. The video’s just dishonest.

  • Anonymous

    As another backer for Mighty No. 9 I can confirm that these concerns were groundless, and that unfortunately a few people went out of their way to deceive their fellow backers. Dina did not express a desire to influence the design of Beck (Which is the character’s name, not Mighty… there’s MANY “Mightys” in the game), she stated back during the kickstarter campaign, before she was an employee, that it would be nice to have Call (the female character) be playable, or if Beck was a girl. someone screengrabbed that and used it to mislead people into thinking she planned on changing Beck’s gender. But the person who screengrabbed that left out what she said next, clarifying she just meant that “select gender” would be a nice option. http://oi43.tinypic.com/hsomc8.jpg comcept themselves had considered that as a stretch goal option during the kickstarter, but deemed it too expensive. But they were thinking along the same lines as her even before employing her.

    Far from being responsible for the designs of characters and scenarios, she’s been clearly stated as playing a small role. She’s stated she’s not a designer for the game and won’t be able to push an agenda on it, and this has been confirmed b Mar MacDonald of 8-4 Inc (who work with comcept on this) and Ben Judd of comcept.

    Some people have been working very hard to use old tweets and comments she made in a misleading way to frighten people such as yourself when there’s not a darn thing to be scared of. It does not make sense for comcept to terminate an employee simply because a smear campaign was unusually successful in generating groundless fears.

  • Michael Taylor

    Calling me out for not checking her Twitter myself is invalid and petty. During the entire 24 hour period while she was under fire she locked her Twitter and deleted numerous posts that were under question and regardless of what actually still remains the fact is she had post saying see never experienced Mega Man and she has posts saying she has, so what is that all about if it’s not a lie then what is it? You can’t defend conflicting posts.

    Now about her credentials it’s great that she went school but her skill set not her education is what counts and that mock up of a female beck looks horrible. Compare that to others mock ups, even sketches from Inafune himself they all match the theme of the game. If you actually did your homework and had access to the forums to read what other professionals and gamers are saying you would understand that the real concern is to make this game right the fact is you didn’t comment on what I said which is she has the authority to make robots and influence the art of the game. Again she stated that herself that she was excited to do that. For you it may not be a big deal but there is over 4 million in pledges that total includes PayPal as well and that money was pledged off of what we saw not what might change. If backers are not happy with this direction it’s our right and our money.

  • Axe Armor

    She is indeed exceedingly secondary. This is why I find your assertion – that because she is “playable” the game’s issues with gender are “not-existant” – exceedingly spurious.

  • The Bechtloff

    I think there is a difference between a long time fan and someone who is merely doing research for a job. I think the Mighty No. 9 backers want a little more heart put into things than someone who is only recently getting into it can put it. But the biggest concern is her tumblr style feminists politics. Sorry but if someone is actually praising Sarkeesian, a proven liar with paper thin arguments, I don’t want them anywhere near any game I want to play.

  • Anonymous

    No offense was intended toward you, and it’s unclear what you read that you felt showed offense. You were depreciating this site for doing insufficient research while yourself relying on the research of others and making several claims that have been debunked. The correction aimed at you was not an attack, merely pointing out that the mistake you were saying this site made was one you made yourself. When claiming you wish to tell the whole story, you should not have glaring omissions in your statements, particularly not ones that people have been pointing out for days.

    Yes, she locked her tweets initially, when she realized individuals were using her tweets selectively, out of context, in a dishonest manner. She showed poor judgement in how she responded, but that’s somewhat understandable.

    There is no lie, and no conflicting posts. During the kickstarter she said she was supporting the project despite not being a MM Player herself (she had played X years before, but did not believe that to be sufficient to consider herself a “MM Player”. After she made that post she learned that comcept might have an opening, and she began playing the games in the hopes of getting the job. These posts are still there, but if you don’t wish to go see them firsthand there’s this screencap. http://oi39.tinypic.com/2r23fvp.jpg There is no contradiction, and no conflict. She wasn’t a MM player, and then she became one.

    Regarding her credentials, her role is not to design anything for the game whatsoever. Her role is to look at the boards, see some comments made in Japanese and English, and pass them on in Japanese and English. Her background in visual creation is something a company would want in someone evaluating fanart, and her experience with game design gives her at least some idea what fan ideas are solid input and which ones would probably be impractical. Comcept is keeping an ear open with the community, but they’ve got a good idea where they want their budget to go, so her role would be more along the lines of passing on ideas for what could be changed improved upon in the polls and contests comcept already has planned. It’s not as if backers are trying to make the game entirely and she’s their one way of passing on information. There will be polls, contests, and surveys, which was always the plan. Comcept never promised forums or a community manager. They went a little further than promised and gave backers a way to further fine-tune their input, and that’s all that she is.

    You are incorrect in assuming it’s “your money” and not mine at all. I am a backer. You are incorrect in stating that I do not have access to the forums. If you do have access yourself, please go there now and look for me. You won’t have a problem finding me. Mighty No. 18951. You will also be able to find, on the “Off Topic” boards, a thread compiling the varous responses from comcept and 8-4 staff regarding various matters. A section of that thread contains their statements which make it abundantly clear that Dina absolutely is not designing anything for the game. Comcept is a small startup company, and needed a bilingual staffer to be the CM, preferably someone that lived in Osaka, knew the staff, and had experience with game design. Because she is also an artist they indicated that they would let her do some design work in the future, to brush up on her skills and be of further use – when you’re a small startup, you use all the tools you have available. But they’ve made it extremely clear that she is not a designer for Mighty No. 9. A designer for comcept yes, a designer for Mighty No. 9, no.

    It’s understandable that you were mislead. It’s at this point well-established what sources have been feeding the disinformation, constructing a lie out of half-truths. No offense was taken from your statement, just sadness. Mighty No.9 was a labor of love, and it’s very depressing that a small number of individuals was so successful in dishonestly misleading other members of the community into thinking that the project is in jeopardy when it’s not. Unfortunately several individuals have pulled their backing over an imaginary threat, and will miss out on the chance to have their names included in the games credits. That’s very sad, and the people who tricked them should be ashamed.

  • César H. Sandoval

    I think Comcept is doing a lot with Call as it is, being this a crowdfunded game, they’d need more money to make her fully playable, is not that they cant or don’t want to, but as I said, the game is already build around a certain character, they would have to go straight from 0 to give Call as much spotlight as Beck, building a whole different game that they already have made until now, and more time to do it as well.

    And Remember, They are robots, the game, like Megaman, is not about “gender” wich machines don’t really have, is about destroying cartoony robots, copying their powers, and destroying more cartoony robots.

  • Anonymous

    Certainly there’s a difference between a long-time fan and someone doing research for the job. The question is: is it a relevant difference?

    Comcept promised they would give users polls, surveys, and contests. That was it. There was no promise of a forum, nor of a Community Manager. Because there was such strong support, comcept went the extra mile and gave us a little more ability to give input. But not a whole lot. Dina’s role is to look at ideas that see particularly strong support in the community (both the English and Japanese forums) and pass it on, in English and Japanese. That’s her entire role.

    Yes, ideally the role would have gone to someone that’s bilingual, lives in Osaka, has experience in art and game design, has played the games, AND played them years ago not recently. Oh well. There’s really nothing we could say to her that she can’t relay to the other comcept staff members just as well as someone that’s been playing the games longer than her.

    There has been zero proof that she is a liar. The claim that she is a liar is based on the idea that she lied about playing Mega Man. That wasn’t a lie. You can still see her tweets in which she played.

    It’s unfortunate that you hate feminists more than you enjoy games, to the extent you would attempt to hurt a game company for employing someone that reblogged Sarkesian’s video, even though her role in the company is extremely minor.

  • The Bechtloff

    I will likely still get Mighty No 9., her involvement not withstanding. But it is a concern. Also I have very little sympathy for someone who cries “harassment” when legitimate concerns are brought up. I have no doubt she faced a few trolls, everyone online does, but that’s no excuse not to face these questions head on. And locking your twitter and then deleting the questionable tweets is shady at best and dishonest at worst. You don’t get to just sweep these things under the rug.

  • The Bechtloff

    Also I called Sarkeesian a liar not Dina. ANd Sarkeesian is a proven liar. For instance “I’m a big gamer” in her kickstarter but months earlier “I don’t like video games”

  • David T.

    They don’t. They’re horrible opinions and I care more about the victims than the bullies. But NO ONE should be imprisoned just for hurting others’ feelings. That’s some 1984-level stuff right there.

  • Aidan Long

    Have you ever tried to pound logic into those little black lumps those trolls call brains, its like trying to chop down a tree with a herring. The best people can do is support the victims in any way they can and not give their roach problem any attention.

  • Magicman

    Are you chronologically challenged?

  • Henry

    So, tell me about the time you sat down with these people to discuss the problems? How did it go? I can guess, but I’d hate to make assumptions.

  • The Bechtloff
  • Erik Miles

    Despite what you may think of Dina’s case, Zoe Quinn’s was undoubtedly harassment. Especially considering that said perpetrators also got a hold of her phone number and started leaving sexually explicit calls.

    But hey, since we’re passing around links, I’ll share one of my own.
    http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/8618-The-Wacky-Harassment-Blame-Parade

    Mr.Sterling puts it better then I ever could.

  • The Bechtloff

    I have no doubt there are a few cases of legitimate harassment, and if Ms. Quinn actually was one of those cases she should get in touch with the authorities if she hasn’t already.
    What I object to is using these cases to shut down all criticism. Or as I like to call it, pulling a Sarkeesian.

  • Erik Miles

    Oh, I don’t doubt you. Even as someone who generally agrees with Anita, I believe there are legitimate criticisms to be made. But that was made entirely impossible when that same community also threatened to rape and kill her. In a way, Sarkeesian is a monster the right created themselves. If any genuine political or analytical is to be had, then this “straight for the jugular” approach needs discouraged. It’s unacceptable on both sides.

  • Anonymous

    It’s really not that difficult to identify legitimate criticism from harassment.

    criticism: “Your argument is wrong because [insert well thought out and articulate argument directly addressing the topic at hand here]…”

    harassment: “You are [insert insult here]…”
    “I’m going to [insert threat here]…”

    See the difference? To borrow examples from the article you link to:
    Good criticism: “She was hired because of nepotism” (which is not uncommon in a small company, which if this is a kickstarter project, it likely is smaller);
    “She’s never even played Mega Man” (So? Matt Smith had never seen Doctor Who; Hugh Jackman never read X-Men; etc. You don’t need to have been a fan to become a fan, and you don’t need to be a fan to make a good product.)

    Not so good criticism:
    “She’s a feminist” (In this case, the argument implies that she will use her position as a forum for espousing her personal views, but that isn’t what they said. They directly attack her, using “feminist” with a negative connotation. To which I reply; So what if she’s a feminist? So is everyone with a fully functioning brain (sorry, that was harassment – again, see the difference?).)

    Harassment: “that scumbag Sarkeesian”

  • Noah

    I’m sorry to burst anyone’s white knight bubble, but I’m pretty sure the Zoe Quinn part is mostly made up as part of a tasteless publicity stunt.

    First of all, as someone who has been an avid Steam user since long before Greenlight was added, and a gamer for most of my life, I can tell you that most gamers don’t know or care about the personal identities about who makes their games. We pay attention to companies (EA, Bioware, etc) but even the most hardcore gamers (including me) would have trouble matching names and faces to the games they play. Game developers aren’t actors or singers, they’re very much behind the scenes.

    Also, most people don’t know or care about games that are Greenlight candidates. Even if they win, they still tend to just fly under the radar. Games that are still in the running for Greenlight tend to get very, very little attention, and their developers even less so. So if you’re going to put a game up for a vote on Greenlight, your odds of actually generating buzz for doing so (either positive or negative) are very slim, either for your game or for your personal identity.

    But let’s pretend for a moment that this actually did happen. That by some crazy fluke, multiple people took the time to browse Greenlight candidates, and then took the time to look at the names of everyone who worked on every game, then went “Aha! This one’s a woman! Time to start a harassment campaign solely on that basis!” I’ve never even heard of Wizard Chan before this article, but it looks like a spin-off of 4chan that’s meant for bitter adult virgins to talk about how much they hate their lives. What would Zoe Quinn be doing on such a site? This site also looks very similar to the other Chans, in that comments tend to come and go very fast, so the chances of her just-so-happening to stumble upon two comments talking crap about her are slim to none, EVEN IF she frequently browses Wizard Chan (which also seems very odd and unlikely). On top of that, the hateful comments about her are written in a way that seems so over-the-top trying to be offensive that it looks more like the people who wrote them were trying to create a caricature of an internet stereotype, or just trying to be as shocking as possible while talking about someone whom nobody actually knows about. Chances are, they were written by someone who works for Quinn, or Quinn wrote them herself, just so she could screen cap them and use them for publicity.

    And who could blame her? Anita Sarkeesian just made over $150,000 from her Kickstarter campaign and became a celebrity amongst the industry after sharing all the details of the harassment she suffered. Now it looks like Zoe Quinn is trying to ride Sarkeesian’s hype train in hopes that she, too, can trigger people’s “save the damsel in distress” tendencies and profit just as much as Sarkeesian did because the exact same thing that happened to Sarkeesian apparently also happened to her. Because apparently, being a victim will help you more than just making a good game. Very clever, Quinn.

    tl;dr: Zoe Quinn’s “harassment” campaign was all a hoax and a tasteless attempt to try and ride Anita Sarkeesian’s hype train in hopes of getting free publicity for her game and extra Greenlight votes out of sympathy.

  • Erik Miles

    I dunno, I think Shigeru Miyamoto, David Cage, Tim Schafer,
    Ron Gilbert, and Cliff Bleszinski (just to name a few) would probably disagree with
    you on the whole “most gamers don’t know or care about the personal identities
    of who makes their games” bit. Movie Directors are very much “behind the scenes”
    people too, but that doesn’t stop them from being well known or liked.

    “Also, most people don’t know or care about the games that are Greenlight
    candidates”.

    A little game called “Papers Please” would like to have a word with you…

    Well, considering she was constantly getting sent links to these “Wizard Chan”
    threads, she was gonna few at least one of them eventually. Of course, even if
    she had made an active attempt to ignore such threads, she was also constantly receiving
    sexual harassing phone calls. Also, really stretching it there with the whole, “She
    probably did this to herself for the publicity”, theory. You might wanna keep
    in mind that most of these “trolls” had a history of doing this. So unless
    Quinn planned this long before any of this happened, your little conspiracy theory
    doesn’t hold any water here.

    …And of course, you end it with a brief “Anita Sarkeesian is the devil” rant.

  • Noah

    Your “just to name a few” list includes only devs who have been influential members of the industry for many years, not obscure indie devs. It takes a lot for one of them to become a household name. I bet you could also name all the singers and guitarists from your favorite classic rock bands, but can you name who plays bass in my neighbor’s experimental funk band? Neither can I. Indie game developers who put games on Greenlight get just about as much attention around the gaming community as you and I do.

    And I don’t see how my skepticism of Quinn’s ridiculous and unproven claims are an attack on Sarkeesian, but nice try. The only one harming Sarkeesian and her efforts are this wolf-crying opportunist who’s hoping to cash in on what Sarkeesian has been through. Although her campaign has unwillingly proven one thing for sure: for every misogynistic creep there is who hates women, there are plenty more easily manipulated white knights who take very little convincing to have their “save the damsel in distress” instincts triggered. Just how many are there? Approximately $150,000 worth. Yes, Sarkeesian has profited immensely from being a damsel, and now Quinn is hoping to do the same. And you’re falling for it.

  • Erik Miles

    Oh, so you want “Indie” developers? Alrighty, I can do that too. Phil Fish (Fez), Edmund McMillen and Tommy Refenes (Super Meat Boy), Jonathan Blow (Braid), and let’s not forget the big behemoth himself, Markus “Notch” Persson (Minecraft). All of them well known within the industry, and they even starred in their own movie. Just because an artist isn’t known by the mainstream public (Notch being the odd exception), doesn’t mean they’re not known with their own industries or that they’re not worth anything. Don’t try to trivialize the matter by saying, “Oh,well she’s just an indie dev”. It’s disrespectful to anyone else in that field.

    That’s precisely why I mentioned it was “brief”. Because apparently, she always has to come up in these conversations and you only dedicated two paragraphs to the subject. Fair enough I suppose, as she is a well-known example. Though this theory you have, unless you can actually provide solid evidence, is really just that; a theory and a pretty wild one at that.

  • Guest

    Now you’re listing developers who technically are “indie,” but have also released titles that have had tremendous breakthrough success and popularity by now, and that’s why you know their names. Again, you only list devs who have been influential members of the industry for a long time. These people are worlds away from all the random Joe Schmoes who are just now trying to get their games onto Steam. Notch’s game has sold millions of copies over the course of the several years that Minecraft has been out. Zoe Quinn isn’t even in the same tier as the people you listed; her game just popped up and nobody even knew her name before she started making some noise on Twitter to try and get Internet journalists to write about her.

    Did you know who Notch, Jon Blow, Tommy Refenes and all those other people were when they were just starting to publicize their games? You probably knew just as much about them back then as I knew about Quinn before she became a victim of this so-called “harassment campaign.” Starting to put a game on Greenlight will get you about as much public attention and controversy as watching TV with your window open. If you went to the list of up and coming Steam Greenlight games right now, could you immediately list the first and last names of all their developers off the top of your head, without searching or reading further? Exactly. That’s why I find her whole story extremely fishy.

    Now, we all know it’s easy to fake what people say about you on a message board, so the only apparent proof she has is that she also received phone calls in which guys behaved in ways that once again sound like an exaggerated caricature of an Internet stereotype, with no provocation at all. Well, have you heard these phone calls? Whether they happened or not, we’ll never know, as it’s illegal to record phone conversations without the permission of both parties, which I doubt she did.

    We’re really going to have to take her word on it for the whole thing. For all we know, maybe it really did happen exactly as she said, but I’m more than 95% certain that this is just a publicity stunt, and that Quinn’s probably grinning at all the comments people have posted saying “poor girl, I’m gonna go vote for her game now because she deserves it after all she’s been through!” I don’t think anyone should be ashamed to have some skepticism about things they read about on the Internet, because when you allow yourself to be conned by professional victims, it really trivializes what happens to the real victims.

  • Noah

    Ok great, now you’re listing developers who technically are “indie,” but have also released titles that have had tremendous breakthrough success and popularity by now, and that’s why you know their names. Again, you only list devs who have been influential members of the industry for a long time. These people are worlds away from all the random Joe Schmoes who are just now trying to get their games onto Steam. Notch’s game has sold millions of copies over the course of the several years that Minecraft has been out. Zoe Quinn isn’t even in the same tier as the people you listed; her game just popped up and nobody even knew her name before she started making some noise on Twitter to try and get Internet journalists to write about her.

    Did you know who Notch, Jon Blow, Tommy Refenes and all those other people were when they were just starting to publicize their games? You probably knew just as much about them back then as I knew about Quinn before she became a victim of this so-called “harassment campaign.” Starting to put a game on Greenlight will get you about as much public attention and controversy as watching TV with your window open. If you went to the list of up and coming Steam Greenlight games right now, could you immediately list the first and last names of all their developers off the top of your head, without searching or reading further? Exactly. That’s why I find her whole story extremely fishy.

    Now, we all know it’s easy to fake what people say about you on a message board, so the only apparent proof she has is that she also received phone calls in which guys behaved in ways that once again sound like an exaggerated caricature of an Internet stereotype, with no provocation at all. Well, have you heard these phone calls? Whether they happened or not, we’ll never know, as it’s illegal to record phone conversations without the permission of both parties, which I doubt she did.

    We’re really going to have to take her word on it for the whole thing. For all we know, maybe it really did happen exactly as she said, but I’m more than 95% certain that this is just a publicity stunt, and that Quinn’s probably grinning at all the comments people have posted saying “poor girl, I’m gonna go vote for her game now because she deserves it after all she’s been through!” I don’t think anyone should be ashamed to have some skepticism about things they read about on the Internet, because when you allow yourself to be conned by professional victims, it really trivializes what happens to the real victims.

  • Erik Miles

    Well, admittedly, my first argument isn’t about “whether
    or not Quinn deserves recognition”, it was more against Noah’s first statement
    of “nobody cares about the personal identities of those that make games”. If
    that statement where genuinely true, then none of those names I mentioned wouldn’t
    even be known to begin with. To a certain extent, people do care; just like
    they care about directors in movies.

    Admittedly though, this is getting off topic. At the end of the day, the whole
    purpose of Greenlight is to give those creative individuals a chance at
    releasing their game; to make the game that they couldn’t otherwise with a
    traditional publisher.

    Oh, I understand that skepticism thing. After all, it does fit in with the
    comfortable narrative we’ve been feed since childhood that, “Ever reaction has
    an action to cause it”, or that people don’t get in trouble without deserving
    so. It’s a nice thought…but it’s a naïve
    one. Sometimes bad things do happen to people for no reason.

  • Sean

    If the community manager does not affect in the gameplay, why does he or she twitters that he or she always designes robots at work? Just asking!

  • Anonymous

    i expected those comments to be buried by now.. they weren’t. that’s a shame.

  • Alex Reynard

    “these persons decided to pry into Dina’s personal life by combing through her Twitter account”

    Twitter is not a person’s personal life. It’s what they have publicly posted on the internet.

    “The answer, of course, is no, because that’s not what a community manager does”

    She said she did, so the answer is yes.

    “In my title I call each of these examples of harassment “inexplicable,”
    even though they have clear explanations: some folks are uncomfortable
    with a woman making video games.”

    No, that’s the explanation you’re *choosing*. I won’t say anything about Zoe’s game because I don’t know anything about it, but I can definitely see both sides of the Dina issue. The problem did not come from her gender, but from how she presented herself at first to the community: as someone whose very first impression was of someone wanting to change the game to suit her personal preferences, who go the job because she knew someone at the company, who never played MegaMan games before, and who presented herself in a less-than-professional manner. If you dismiss all of that, and instead insist that this is nothing but sexism, you’re acting like that guy with the hair on the History channel who thinks aliens are the answer for any ambiguity.

  • Alex Reynard

    Difference between Smith & Jackman, and Dina: Smith and Jackman were playing a role written for them. If they had been hired on as creators, and admitted they knew nothing about the fandom, that would raise some eyebrows. Now, if Dina was a voice actor and said the same thing, I think people would care less.

  • Anonymous

    Smith and Jackman are absolutely creators. They create the character. They decide mannerisms and inflections, tone of voice. They have to know these characters well enough to become them on screen. Yes, others like the director have input as well, and can help guide them. But it’s their performance we see, and if they don’t get it, we won’t believe it. As for Dina, she’s not a creator. She doesn’t have any input into the final product.

    And even if she were the lead in charge of the entire product, it still wouldn’t change the fact that you don’t have to already be a fan to become a fan, and you don’t have to already be familiar with the product to become familiar with the product. We all start somewhere. I didn’t start reading X-Men till the late 90′s. I didn’t start with them in the 60′s because I wasn’t even born then. Yet I’m a huge fan. I didn’t watch Sherlock until just yesterday, but I love it. Watched the first two seasons this weekend. I’m absolutely a fan.

  • Alex Reynard

    >Yes, others like
    the director have input as well, and can help guide them. But it’s
    their performance we see, and if they don’t get it, we won’t believe it.

    Ehhhh… I see where you’re coming from, but I honestly think the writer deserves way more credit. (Then again, I’m a writer myself, so I may be biased.)

    >As for Dina, she’s not a creator. She doesn’t have any input into the final product.

    Except she tweeted that she DOES have input, that she was designing characters.

    >And even if she were the lead in charge of the entire product, it still
    wouldn’t change the fact that you don’t have to already be a fan to
    become a fan, and you don’t have to already be familiar with the product
    to become familiar with the product.

    That’s fair. However, from what I understand, familiarity with the fandom was essential for this particular project. This is meant to be a reward to all the hardcore fans of the MegaMan series. I’m not so much a game guy myself, but I’m imagining this is something I’ve loved for *decades*, and then one of the most visible members of the dev team admits to having never been a fan and having only played one game… that would fill me with dread.

    If nothing else, I think it shows that Dina is simply a bad choice for this job because She Obviously Doesn’t Know PR. If she’s going to be the public face of the dev team, yet has no clue how her messages are going to be received by the community, that’s a bad sign. She should have at least known that it was a bad idea to publicly *say* that she got the job due to friends on the inside and that she’s not a fan.

    Or, hey, a good way to repair her image would be to show an interest. Show that she’s *becoming* a fan and playing the games and reading up on the backstory.

  • Keyser Soze

    Feminists accuses other people of not knowing how biology works, while herself not knowing what endorphins or oxytocin do.

    If sex doesnt make you feel happy, then either your boyfriend is supernaturally terrible in bed, or you are a lesbian/have an unfixably broken brain

  • Keyser Soze

    So basically what youre saying is “they asked for it”, and that bad things happen to people because they actually deserve it? Sounds like Victim Blaming to me!

  • Anonymous

    Form what I’ve gather the Dana bit isn’t about the fact she’s a woman (because all issues with a woman MUST be by sexist right?) its that people here are megaman fans and Megaman has been for lack of better words dicked around by Capcom for years.

    So a Love Letter to Magaman is being made between fans and the creator and the person who got the job wants to change it to fit her veiws, said person (funny you forgot this btw) isn’t a Magaman fan and only got the job more or less due to nepotism.

    Said person is the bridge between fans and creators, who is KNOW to banned people for little to no reason ie removing those who don’t stare her veiws.

    No it has to be because she’s a woman. This is why no one likes feminism anymore because you make it about gender and use there gender as a shield.