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BBC Writer Explains How Torchwood Lost It With Miracle Day

Your mileage may vary but I really hated Torchwood: Miracle Day. It took what was once a really unique sci-fi show with interesting characters and turned it into a bland U.S. extension with awful character development. If you found yourself thinking the same, you’re not alone. Doctor Who and Torchwood writer Chris Chibnall thinks he knows why it didn’t work. 

Chibnall did an interview with Starburst Magazine in which they discussed his new series Broadchurch (starring David Tennant and Arthur Darvill) as well as the most recent Torchwood installment.

I did a bit of very early storylining with Russell on Miracle Day, right at the start, before they pitched it to Fox, before they pitched it to Starz. I think somewhere along the way it sort of lost a little bit of its Torchwood-ness. Whether you like or dislike Torchwood, it has an essence – of madness and cheekiness and sexiness, and fun and darkness, those sort of polar facets of what it’s about, of putting those things together – and somehow it lost a bit of that somewhere in the process. when we were first talking about it, it was something a bit bolder, a bit cheekier. it may just come back to the fact that one of the great essences of Torchwood was taking those American tropes and doing them in Wales. And in a way, that’s what made Torchwood so brilliantly odd. Once you put it in California, it becomes more like other shows.

But they didn’t forget Torchwood was criticized by Doctor Who fans when it was first announced. “That’s why you can’t go on the internet, that’s why you can’t get involved, because you have to be writing for another reason, you have to be writing because you want to,” Chibnall said. “Literally the first dinner I had with Russell [T. Davies], and I hadn’t agreed to do the job, the first thing he said to me was, ‘If you come and do this, you must never go on-line ever again. It doesn’t matter whether you write brilliant stuff or shit stuff or whatever, it will destroy you.’ I think he gave that piece of advice to everyone.”

As for a return of the show, Chibnall wasn’t optimistic. “It’s entirely down to Russell,” he said. “I would expect he will have other things he’ll want to write, to be honest.” Davies is busy with Wizards vs. Aliens at the moment.

(via Blastr)

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  • Geoffrey Dow

    It wasn’t going to California that ruined Torchwood, it was turning out a script that was dumber than a protozoa.

  • Anonymous

    Right. I mean the first season of Torchwood was pretty damn awful too. Bad writing is bad writing no matter what side of the pond it comes from.

  • Anonymous

    I do however agree about how it’s probably for the best to step away from the internet and not get overly involved. There’s a great quote from Bruce Timm where he points out that statistically, the message board posts are in the minority anyway, so you’re likely going to get a very negative, skewed view.

  • Anonymous

    Much like Community, I do not know anything about a mythical fourth season.

    More importantly, Tennant & Darvill are teaming up?

  • Bill Hedrick

    I disagree in the most negative skewed fashion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111111

  • Brian McDonald

    I maintain that there was a fairly decent 5-6 episode story in there somewhere. It started out strongly, dealing with the quasi-realistic fallout from no one dying. The corporate death camps had some potential for existential horror. But it just derailed because they had to pad it out to 10 episodes. “I know there’s a crisis that’s crushing the world, Jack, but we have to spend an episode or two to save my dad!” Bleagh.

  • Anonymous

    Chris Chibnall is the last person who should talk about bad Who writing. Cold Blood, 42, The Power of Three, Dinosaurs on a Spaceship… He’s terrible.

  • Jill Pantozzi

    Oh yes, I found the story really interesting, it was just the overall execution of it all.

  • Elwyne

    I TOTALLY AGREE I thought Miracle Day was crap, especially after the brutal genius that was Children of Earth. Torchwood has never been the most sharply written show on earth, but with Miracle Day it reached new lows.
    On the other hand, it was all worth it because GWEN COOPER.

  • Jill Pantozzi
  • Anonymous

    It would appear that the advice for show creators to not read anything on the internet is sound.

  • Anonymous

    Thanks, Jill!

  • Liz Baker

    More accurate title: “BBC Writer Blames America for Terribly-Written Show Culminating in Terribly-Written Finale, Asserts That Writers Should Block Out All Criticism”.

    Kind if think that second point goes a lot longer to explaining the decidedly-mediocre modern Who franchise as a whole than arbitrarily asserting that it’s all OUR fault.

  • James Hannan

    I hated Torchwood because it failed miserably to deliver the goods. See how Chibnall says that it was supposed to be cheeky, mad, dark and sexy? That Was Never Torchwood. That was what I seriously hoped it would, especially with the ever Great John Barrowman as the magnificient Jack Harkness leading the show. Instead we got an awfully depressing (literally) season one with such hateful, wretched characters, and an average, but still depressing, season two (except James Masters; he was frickin awesome).
    And then season 3 came along; it went from being disappointment to sheer hatred as it out right murdered my engagement with Captain Jack as a character with its cheap dark choices.
    Miracle Day did not save it as it still had all the same abominable characteristics, only as 24 knock-off (seriously, out of all the TV dramas they could rip-off, they rip off that one).
    In short, Children of Earth was the brutal murder of this show’s potential; Miracle Day was the burial.

  • Anonymous

    Miracle Day made me so sad. The worst part about it is the central premise made absolutely no sense. There’s nothing special about Jack’s blood. What happened to Jack was SO UNIQUE that The Doctor had never seen it
    before. What happened to him went way beyond the mere biological. He’s got something metaphysical going on that’s ‘stuck’ him and made him a fixed point. I can kinda get the bit about the big gash in the planet resetting based on his blood or life essence or whatever (and the whole no one dying thing did have promise) but the part at the end with Rex getting his immortality just made me toss my hands up in frustration. The one good thing about Rex as a character was that he was trying to fix this mess, despite knowing that it would probably mean he’d die.

    A cardinal sin of a series is breaking with its own established universe mechanics. If it was as simple as a blood transfusion to gain Jack’s immortality, the Doctor would have found ways to prevent that from happening. Also, Jack has been kidnapped, tortured and experimented on before. If there was something special about his blood, someone else would have sorted that out ages ago.

    Torchwood was definitely not perfect. There were some bad episodes (sex mist, for one) but as the article says,its essence was completely disrespected and rewritten in Miracle Day. What’s even sadder is that there were original showrunners involved. It felt like a slap in the face to the fans to change everything that we liked about it to begin with.

    I don’t normally get upset by TV shows, but Miracle Day still makes me angry even after all this time. I hope it never comes back, as much as I’d love to see Jack and Gwen in action again. Having it back again means Immortal Rex would have to be there and it’d be in the US. There’d be no Hub and no Cardiff. What’s the point?

    If you haven’t already, do yourself a favour and listen to the radio dramas. They take place between Season 2 and Children of Earth. True Torchwood in all the ways it was meant to be.

  • Craig Oxbrow


  • Chris Brocco

    I am not a Doctor Who fan so I didn’t know it was a spin off I watched the 1st episode with an open mind then I watched the 2nd and was like WTF is this crap and stopped watching.

  • Anonymous

    To be fair, the second episode is pretty much the worst that Torchwood gets (until Miracle Day, that is.) It gets better from there. I usually tell people I recommend the show to, to skip episode 2.

  • Sarah Parker

    I had to stop watching Torchwood. There was too much sensationalism for me.

  • Brian

    Miracle day was just like Children of Earth. A very good five episode miniseries. Then some idiot decided to stretch it to 13 episodes. Also the ending sucked.

  • Lady Viridis

    Miracle Day was definitely awful. Key issues I had:

    > WHERE WERE THE ALIENS? If the premise of your show is that you have this organization set up to fight alien weirdness when the Doctor isn’t around, there should probably be aliens involved at some point. That the whole ‘Miracle Day’ turned out to be generic corporate evil was not only disappointing but really hard for me to believe.

    > Never break your own canon. What happened to Jack was totally unexpected and impossible to replicate. Jack’s blood as an explanation for anything in that series made no sense. Neither did Jack losing his immortality after the miracle.

    I feel like the concept was good, but they stretched it out too far and took out a lot of what made the series Torchwood in an effort to make it more appealing to a broader/American audience. Although I also wonder if maybe the budget wasn’t TOO good– I’ve long held that RTD is a good writer only when you don’t give him money for explosions. Midnight is a brilliant episode of Doctor Who with some amazing writing. The S3, S4 finales and The End of Time? Not so much. (Obviously YMMV, but I found RTD’s insistence on ever-bigger ever-more-explodey finales increasingly tiresome.)

  • Mark Matson

    Miracle Day managed to be both highly disturbing and painfully boring. I didn’t think it was possible for both to be true at the same time. I never did finish watching that. I say this as a Torchwood fan that only recently got into Dr. Who.

  • Anonymous

    honestly, I never finished Miracle Day. I got three or four episodes in and gave up. I’ve shunned it so hard that I’ve never actually discussed the mess with another Torchwood fan. I’m glad I’m not the only one who cringes at the thought of it.

    Sadly, Miracle Day has turned me off to another Torchwood run. I’m not sure you can redeem it after that. I’d rather let Torchwood go with Children of Earth. It’s not worth beating the dying horse.

  • Diane Phillipa

    The plot of MD has so many plot holes a sieve could hold more water We were left with Miss Wheepy knickers who was so stupid her shoes had a higher IQ than she did. Rex who was the least likeable homophoic on screen character I have seen for a long time. Gwen miss shouty loud mouth who becase ever more annoying and redundant. Jack absent without leave for most of the first six episodes. Thrown away the only genuine cliff hanger. Continuity errors (why was Jack wearing his WW2 RAF coat in 1932 for example) It jumped all over the place, suddenly a character Oswald turns up in teh UK and is not recongised (how did he get there if there is no air travel did he swim the atlantic? Gwen who is supposed to be in hiding as she is a wanted woman not only travels across the atlantic twice, she stomps around shouting her mouth off all over Wales, then robs chemists armed and still no one gets its her. Then the gian womans thing in the ground. Apprently there is a imporable hole that runs between the centre of the earth and no scientist execpt the incompetent villians of this drama have figured out. And finally the most unforgivable sin, they made Rex Immortal. In what universe would you make HIM immortal. It suggested that hte makers did not care about what they were doing. I now fanfiction writers who could have done a better job. All this did was kill TW for good. RIP TW. Gone is the quirky fun camp show we loved.

  • Diane Phillipa

    Gwen Cooper the adulter reconning liar Gwen Cooper. Miss Shouty mouth me me me I’m important look at me Gwen Cooper!

  • Diane Phillipa

    We gathered as a group all 14 of us to have an MD marthon, By episode 5 only 6 of us remained. At episode 7 two. We only watched because we hoped the following Gwen Cooper would be killed Rex Matheson will die a horrible death and someone would put Esther out of her misery hopefully by throwing her off a building. It is 10 hours of my life I will never get back.

  • Anonymous

    Did this guy write Cyberwoman? Wow, all comments are instantly void then.

  • electrasteph

    Can’t speak for anyone else, but I didn’t see it because it was on Starz. Why would I add a premium channel I’m barely aware of to watch one show?

  • Elwyne

    Anyone who puts earmuffs on her baby before blowing away a helicopter with a handgun wins for cool points alone. That and the “I’m Welsh” line were enough for me – beating the crap out of the annoying redhead at the end was sweet sweet bonus. :)

    Gwen is hardly alone among her cohorts in making stupid choices; that just seems to go with Torchwood territory.

  • Emi Powers

    Miracle Day started out well, in my opinion. What I liked about Children of Earth was the focus on the human and societal (and, largely, governmental) reaction to everything, and Miracle Day had that.
    But then we get to the climax and the actual cause of everything, and there’s a big, bloody, cinnamon stick through the Earth. What.

  • Anonymous

    Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think Children of Earth was some bizarre fluke that had no business being a Torchwood story at all. It was more like a Nigel Kneale Quatermass miniseries than Torchwood, in that it was relentlessly dark and stark, but treated with a gravity that warranted such a grim look. Torchwood in general was meant to be silly fun escapades with a cast of bisexuals, not hard-hitting social commentary.

    Miracle Day was terrible because Russel T. Davies got his painfully unsubtle and unnuanced writer-on-board with the most leaden Holocaust “symbolism” I’ve ever seen. Americanisation had nothing to do with it; neither did the gay sex or button-pushing issues with the paedophile messiah. It was just horribly written and badly executed.

  • Anonymous

    Wow, I didn’t think Miracle Day was that bad! It was pretty engaging and watchable. I’m not surprised to see it hated by TW fans, though, as I agree it was very different from TW-proper.

    But then what I saw of the first couple of series of TW was frankly rubbish so as Miracle Day apparently abandonned everything that made TW what it was, it’s no wonder I preferred it. At least for the first half of the series – it kind of lost its way and didn’t seem to know what to do with its premise after a certain point.

    I’m more surprised to see Children Of Earth hated here – I got the impression it was very well regarded? I thought it was excellent.

  • Jen

    Looks like I get to have the unpopular opinion! I loved it. It wasn’t the sheer genius of CoE, no – but it still proved Gwen’s first words in CoE, that Jack’s Doctor must sometimes look down on us in shame and turn away.

    The performances were fantastic. I’m not actually much of a Mekhi Phifer fan, but after an ep or two, he grew on me. (Although he should have gotten the asskicking of the century for pulling Gwen away from her child.) And how do we know that Jack’s blood ISN’T what has the secret of his immortality? We don’t know what Bad Wolf Rose did, exactly. All we know is that the Doctor FEELS that he is a fixed point in time. It could have been due to properties inherent in his blood now. Maybe part of the Heart of the Tardis is somehow in his bloodstream now.

    The performances? Barrowman can do no wrong in my eyes. I’ve always loved Gwen. And Bill Pullman pulled out such a sick, wrong, horrifying performance that I don’t even know if I can watch him again without thinking about Dane.

    I trust Chibnall. No, it wasn’t perfect, but I do believe it was well done. And I trust Jane Espenson more.

  • Kol Drake

    Read someone saying — Never let the Americans ‘do’ a British show — they just won’t get it right. (( think they may have been referring to the 1996 Doctor WHO Fox movie. )) But, think it still holds true. Hollyweird just does not ‘get’ why fans from a decades long show might LIKE to see some connection to the original material.

  • Kol Drake

    There have been several ‘his blood grants immortality’ type movies and made for television shows since the 60s as I recall. All of those failed for not making sense about the whole blood deal; or why one evil guy KNOWS all about the blood factor and spends his fortune to get it before he dies. I Know they say, there only a handful of stories… it’s how you dress it up that counts. Someone failed on their ‘what to wear’ duties here.

  • Red_Rabbit

    It was so frustrating to watch. While the show had individual moments that were great, so much was just awful. A geological anomaly that global geophysicists and geologists hadn’t noticed before? Blood being drained from one person and infused into another by a non-professional and just left sitting around to *rot*?

    The basic premise of Jack’s blood being somehow special (immortal) when it was established by Doctor Who canon that it is not and he was brought back to life and is able to resurrect due to external forces (the time vortex). Subverting established canon was a massive failure.

    Throughout I couldn’t help but to think of Dumbledore’s comment from the Harry Potter series that a blood payment is rather crude. I couldn’t agree more. This season was crude, unsophisticated and a disappointment.

  • Red_Rabbit

    Gwen’s Welsh joke got old real fast. I was hoping she and the redhead would punch each other out and then we wouldn’t have to listen to either one again.

  • Red_Rabbit

    Russell T. Davies was dropping anvils all over the place. Jane Espenson and her awful writing should be left on a desert island somewhere. (She ruined Battlestar Galactica too, and everything else she gets her grubby hands on.)

  • Jason Litzau

    Not to mention mind rapist, when she erased her own boyfriend’s memories of her adultery confession, screaming “I NEED YOU TO FORGIVE ME!!!” over and over, as he passes out.

  • Scott Blais

    Well we must remember that RTD and his cohorts were really in charge of this, they had complete control, the script was not American, it was British. Even Julie was in charge also. It was not fantastic, but it was ok. There are for worse Torchwoods made in UK, one word, Cyberwoman ha!

  • Alberto Leal

    Go back and watch Torchwood from the very first episode. You will see how wrong you are.

  • Chris Madison

    Miracle Day proved to be a great disappointment to me. At the end of Torchwood, Season Three, it appeared to me that the series had painted itself into corner with the loss of Owen, Ianto, and Tosh, and that the series would need to re-invent itself. As the fourth season moved beyond Children of Earth, it seemed to lose creativity and to depart from the “essence” of Torchwood, and disconnected itself with Dr. Who’s timeline and any continuity with that program. It appeared to me that Miracle Day took on an American flavor, rather than the highly creative British flavor of the first three seasons. More gratuitous sex, much more violence, and a return to a “nazification” of the human race, with what might almost be called a “final solution” to the impact of Miracle Day. Season four displays the potential depravity of the human race, which always lies beneath the surface, hidden until some crisis happens, which conceivably brings out the worst in us. This is not the hopeful and hope-filled series that Doctor Who is. And, I think that a good series has been turned into yet another show that has lost is essence or “soul,” if you will. So sad. So sad.

  • JamesJournal

    What RTD was saying was that since there will be incredibly negative and contradictory criticism to everything that is done with a franchise like Doctor Who, the writing staff basically can’t listen to it and remain productive.

  • Andrew

    I guess I’m alone in feeling that Torchwood: Miracle Day was perhaps one of the most emotionally masterful pieces of art to ever grace the small screen. What the series did not do for me at any point, was make me feel good however. It was a gut-wrenching, miserable experience that left me moderately traumatized (particularly the death of Dr. Vera Juarez). That, my friends, is powerful writing. I own the DVD set, but cannot bring myself to watch it again because it sets me into such a raging depression that I cannot function as a human being. Children of Earth was much of the same, and you might be able to say that of series 2 as well. The show changed direction, but series 1 and 2 were mostly boring to me, and I feel the change in direction was good for the story, and cannot wait for series 5, if it ever happens.

  • Nat

    Children of Earth had so much potential and then it just… maybe because it was dark in addressing what could be done and killing hte rest of the team… IDK. I was okay with Torchwood being darker than DW (Like BtVS vs Angel) but Torchwood never seemed well done to me. Like it had so much potnetial and didn’t know what to do with itself.

  • Nat

    But Jack is Immortal because Rose couldn’t properly control her Bad Wolf powers. It was nothing heriditary or science fiction, it was Rose wanting to bring him back to life!

  • Anonymous

    I’m a Yank so my opinions undoubtedly are different than most Brits but for me, Children of Earth was the high point of this series. By a wide margin. I thought it was fantastic. Miracle Day started off rough for me. I didn’t like that it was in the USA and it “felt” different than the UK produced series. But, after some adjustment time, I actually ended up feeling like Miracle Day was my 2nd favorite season. I thought the first couple seasons of the show were really uneven…some great episodes mixed in with some not so great ones.
    I agree the ending of Miracle Day was crap, but that’s not the USA’s fault. The show runner was still Davies and it was his baby to do with as he pleased.

  • Anonymous

    I actually thought Miracle Day was the most well done season of Torchwood, yet.

    I couldn’t really get behind the overall plot or even the characters in the first two seasons. Children of the Earth was better and much more unique with a great plot, but moved slowly, didn’t really “open the kimono” at the end, and left a lot of loose ends (like the corrupt politician lady, who first suggested eugenics, assuming power in the end, as if it was an improvement, WTF).

    However, with Miracle Day, I like how an interesting, concise story was woven throughout the series without relying on each episode to tell its own story. The plot was compelling and intriguing, with plenty of mystery, and the characters were much more meaningful. Jack and Gwen may not have developed much, but Esther and Rex were fascinating to watch.

    Also, I liked the idea of making the everything more real. Doctor Who is great for idealistic, childlike fantasy explorations, but Miracle Day brought everything much closer to home in a very uncomfortable way, using science fiction as a plot catalyst and setting instigator, but not a focus. I definitely appreciated that.

  • Anonymous

    I don’t agree with your assessment of the original Torchwood characters, but I do agree that Miracle was a massive improvement over the first two seasons.

  • Anonymous


    Doctor Who is fantastic.

    Torchwood is flawed gem with shimmers of greatness, with the finale being particularly excellent. It certainly deserves some criticism, but most of it is for the wrong reasons. Torchwood was supposed to a down-to-earth counterpart to the outlandish fantasy of Doctor Who. As adults know, you can’t simply wave a wand and set everything right in the end. One has to make hard choices. Torchwood captured that well.

  • Anonymous

    You don’t get it. The darkness is part of it.

    In real life, tough circumstances can force one has to make hard choices, often with no happy ending. The Doctor can’t always swoop in to the rescue. Tragedy happens.

    Also, Miracle Day was brilliant and great improvement on the cheaper episodic style of the first two seasons. which were way too rife with extraterrestrial events to be plausible in an Earth-based team.

  • Liz Baker

    Yeah, only no.

    1) Glad you like Torchwood and Doctor Who, but your opinion on their quality certainly does not in any way change my experiences with them. I’ve seen both. DW is not fantastic, and Torchwood is a million miles away from being “down to earth”. (Do you perhaps mean “grittier”? Because it did manage that on occasion. Certainly with more sex! But more realistic than DW? Hahahaha no.)

    Look: The nicest thing I can say for Torchwood is that it was very rushed. In a huge hurry to get to the ‘good’ episodes, it forgot to take the time to invest us in its world or characters. So for example we learn that Ianto has a terrible secret — IN THE FOURTH EPISODE. Come on, that’s just stupidly impatient. We barely knew who he was. Imagine how much better the impact would have been if they’d been able to keep some of their shocking plot twists in their pants for a while and had let any of the characters actually stand on their own for five minutes. But no, because the Torchwood writers were much too insecure for that; in obvious desperation to stop you from changing the channel, they just keep piling on the shocks until you’re numb from it all.

    By Miracle Day, I had really long ceased caring about anyone living or dying.

    2) Really? You can’t just wave a magic wand and make things better? OMG you’re right that’s so deep.

    But no really, thinking that darker always means deeper — that sad endings are always artistically better than happy ones — is very adolescent reasoning. The fact is that sad endings are often easier and lazier.

    And if the point of Torchwood was that adults have to make decisions and then live with the consequences, it’s unfortunate that the show completely lacked adults. All the characters were selfish and self-absorbed and routinely waved away their bad choices with various pieces of stolen alien tech rather than accepting responsibility or learning anything. No one had any control over their egos, much less their ids.

    But I don’t think DW is better at this point, if that helps any. Certainly it’s not more mature.

  • Anonymous

    I liked it as well. There were parts that felt a bit stilted and the ending rushed, but overall it was good.

    points to remember. Gwen had to have some side plot because Gwen’s whole point for being chosen by Jack is to add HEART and HUMANITY back to Torchwood. The original Torchwood became out of control monsters of humanity and the Doctor had to put THEM down as much as the Cybermen in that episode. The ending of MD is a clear departure from the original charter of Torchwood to put Britain on the Galactic Offensive. Now Torchwood is much more what The Doctor would appreciate…. to protect Humans from their greatest threat…. THEMSELVES. Gwen’s journey is really the heart of the Torchwood story and she’s finally in a place SHE could re-found it on her own… no Jack, no Doctor needed.

    As far as the Blessing, it was intended to be “bigger than life”, not to be understood. Jack is not the Doctor with infinite knowledge of all the alien races. He can only do the best he can and know humans are still around in thousands of years when he is born. The story is Earth, out there on it’s own trying to figure things out. Frankly its not Jack’s blood as much as his profile that the Blessing has to keep track of. One Jack is an anomaly among humans the Blessing can remember to keep out of it’s “average” lifespan. Unless you trick the Blessing to think the WHOLE WORLD is Jack by having him be in two halfs of the world at once. So it’s not really anything special about Jack, just using him to confuse the Blessing.

  • Ched Groundheggin

    the biggest mistake was stretching out a thin story over 12 episodes- the previous series worked because it was only 6- miracle day was just dragged out.

  • Anonymous

    Sometimes you have to ignore the glitch to enjoy the storyline. I’ve been watching Dr. Who since it was first shown here in the USA and I’ve continued watching it and its spin offs. I loved Miracle Day. But I’d watch anything to see with the actors who grace the show. They did get the way our governments/big businesses would react totally right.

  • Kevin Burnard

    I rather liked Miracle Day as well. Maybe it’s because they saved all the character development for the lovely Jilly Kitzinger?

  • chris

    RTD is a Douch-nozzle. If he doesnt want it, (i.e.cant figure out a clever way to write it) then he should sell the rights to someone that does want to do TW justice. such a unique show should not stay in the dusty basement of RTDs moms house.

  • Mark Stone

    Kol.. there were very few (if any?) American writers involved in the script writers as I recall. If anything giving it to Stars over FOX, should have ensured the correct touch remained in the script, but RTD and Chibnail blew it with the ending.

  • chris

    You MUST be from an alternate timeline! lol

  • chris

    Cyberwoman was THE epitome of what made TW great. Overblown dramatics, cheesy one liners and sex in a can (i,e, Lisa) and Ianto and Jack fighting over his GF. I loved it.

  • chris

    perfectly said friend.

  • Anonymous

    It’s not in his blood or it would have been passed on through his child. Who is not immortal.

  • Anonymous

    I feel like the trouble with Torchwood was that after the amazing third season, with its plot that covered the entire season, the show couldn’t go back, if they’d gone back to ‘alien of the week’ format people would be twice as disappointed as they are with Miracle Day. So they dug deeper and followed the same format, except this time they couldn’t give it the same spark of life (culminating in a terrible ending – although I loved the build up) and that buried the show for good. :/

  • Jake Criss

    It died the moment they lost Owen, Ianto and Tosh. You can’t kill leads all at once and expect success. THAT SIMPLE.

  • SCP3

    “Whether you like or dislike Torchwood, it has an essence – of madness
    and cheekiness and sexiness, and fun and darkness, those sort of polar
    facets of what it’s about, of putting those things together – and
    somehow it lost a bit of that somewhere in the process.”

    The somewhere in the process was called Children of Earth. There was no cheekiness or sexiness or fun in Children of Earth; it was a soul sucking experience. Don’t get me wrong, it was a great series, but after everything that happened in it, that was an end of Torchwood.

  • SCP3

    “Whether you like or dislike Torchwood, it has an essence – of madness
    and cheekiness and sexiness, and fun and darkness, those sort of polar
    facets of what it’s about, of putting those things together – and
    somehow it lost a bit of that somewhere in the process.”

    The somewhere in the process was called Children of Earth. There was no cheekiness or sexiness or fun in Children of Earth; it was a soul sucking experience. Don’t get me wrong, it was a great series, but after everything that happened in it, that was an end of Torchwood.

  • Anonymous

    I agree, I thought the show was unwatchable til season 3. And no, Miracle Day wasn’t as great as Children of Earth, but it still had plenty of amazine ideas and moments that make me glad I saw it. Honestly, I think the biggest problem was trying to stretch it out for 10 episodes – 6 or 7 would have been fine, there was plenty of fat to trim (C. Thomas Howell’s hitman, I’m looking at you)

  • Anonymous

    Great point – he’s an uneven writer at best -

  • Anonymous

    I think the argument could be made that since Jack’s blood was in him when the Blessing reset things that is what made him immortal. Obviously it’s difficult to try applying logic to fantasy, but it seems reasonable within the reality of the show

  • Anonymous

    I see that side of things, but Jack’s blood has been harvested and tested before, his blood is not special. HE is special. He’s a fixed point in time. Watch again and listen, he talks about it. His blood has nothing to do with his immortality. It’s Bible and they deviated from that for a decent plot line (I actually enjoyed the story, it just didn’t make sense).

  • Anonymous

    Again, I think it would be easy for them to come up with a time-wimey explanation for it i.e. even though the blood doesn’t make someone immortal it does have the morphic field signature of an immortal (which would not have shown up in any known test), so when the Blessing reset all things with that field back to immortal Max was changed. When you get to make up the rules for the universe you can always find an explanation for something-

    I had much more difficulty suspending my disbelief over things like Oswald Danes becoming a celebrity after giving a speech or holding a baby.

    But I agree, the story overall really didn’t make sense, but I can overlook it since it had some great parts (and a LOT of poorly done filler – at 5 episodes it would would been a great series, at 10 episodes it was VERY uneven) But the same could be said for X-Files, Lost, BSG, even a lot of Doctor Who (i.e. Why was the 9th Doctor killed by holding the vortex inside but Rose wasn’t? If you can make a Time Lord by simply conceiving a baby in the vortex then why isn’t every time-traveling race creating Time Lords? etc)

  • opalexian

    Watching the end of the BBC America run of Miracle Day, I can only say that it seemed like the story, writing, and casting of American actors became so disconnected that ending it with a giant gash in the earth that needed to eat all of Jack’s not-special blood just kind of ended up….cancelling itself out. But now with an American dude (who’s also now immortal!) to start repopulating the team. That’s one episode of material at most, and the presence of (very amazing) Bill Pullman in one of his better performances ended up just being him wearing a suicide vest and excited to go to hell so he can chase his young victim forever.

    …why was she in hell? I guess because Miracle Day was a pit of hell that had eaten Torchwood. I am disappoint and needed to internet about it. Thanks, Mary Sue, for making me feel less alone in this weird hell.

  • lgb

    Miracle day had a few great things about it. I loved the story concept, the way that Gwen grew in this season was fun (Her line of “I’m Welsh” just felt so badass, along with her firing a gun at a helicopter while holding a baby!), The whole notion of having to burn people alive and Jack possibly dying were all done very well. Also there is nothing bad about Lauren Ambrose’s character, she was hilarious and I will hear no bad about her

    The bad however was that yeah, it dragged on a fair amount, it lost a lot of the flavor of the original and at no point do they mention Ianto who was a major part of last season that you’d think Jack would still be dealing with, but no he moves on and screws a bartender because apparently that’s how that works. Also moving it to the US really had no major purpose other than “We have more sets now”.

    Honestly had they cut the season to 6 episodes and trimmed the pointless parts, this could’ve been absolutely amazing. As it is it’s kind of ho-hum

  • shulkman

    I liked your last couple of points, thought I’d share my idea on it. Why did 9 die and not Rose? Have you ever had a bad tire on the highway? It gets hot, the rubber thins, it’ll blow unless you fix the issue. She took the time vortex into herself, a whole lot of power in a skin sandwich. The Doctor drew it out of her and into himself, like snakebite venom, and the last person to contain all that energy is the one who gets the damage. Look at the The End of Time, where Ten trades himself to save Wilfred, but in the next “big save/sacrifice”, there’s a clear, well-labeled prop (with actual signs to explain the plot device and silence the confusion of the fans.

    As far as the baby in the vortex, there’s a line in A Good Man goes to War that touched on it… It basically said Exposure to the vortex didn’t cause the extra DNA to just show up, but it gave Kovarian a head start, allowing them to make further modifications on the child during the course of the pregnancy and get the desired extra genetic material.

  • shulkman

    I only started watching DW about 6 months ago. It became my summer project, watch the show, learn about it, fill in that gap in my popular culture knowledge. I started with Rose and went from there, staying out of the old series, but reading up on every dangling plot point and device and reference. I did watch the 1996 movie and the Three Doctors and Five Doctors specials. Since I’m “new” to the party, I don’t find myself quite as angry about writers. RTD brought it back which wasn’t an easy task. The big season arc stories were far more removed from the weekly action, which I think Moffat has improved on by making the big arc more central to the individual episodes. It gives the last episode of the season a bit more impact. The two writers have different approaches, but I would not call either of them a “bad” writer. I don’t have a “favorite” writer. I have my favorite characters, or a favorite story. I liked Torchwood, but I think I actually prefer the single story format seen in Children and Miracle Day. (Even if the story itself could put you in a therapist’s chair. Some really dark stuff in the last stories, but once you pulled yourself out of the soul-demolishing depression brought on by Children of Earth, you realized just how much writing and imagination went into the story. I’d like to see Miracle Day finished up.

  • James Anderson Merritt

    Just watching Miracle Day now, exp 5 (Categories of Life). At the very first, the scene caption says we’re in “City Hall, Washington DC.” Behind our heroine MY and her associate, only intermittently in focus in the corridor is a floor standing CALIFORNIA flag! Budget too low for a continuity checker? A US flag would have been OK, although there is probably a DC city flag.


    I am amazed that BBC managed to ruin their second greatest and highest earning franchise, only a decade after ruining it’s first (the first time they killed doctor who, not to be confused with their current attempt by doing the same things to all three) by changing the time of airing, spending years between series’, going for mini series instead of serial (they’re also doing this nonsense to Sherlock right now, you get three episodes every three years, which is absurd!) but I think it’s all probably because as viewership wanes it pays more to flop and claim entertainment insurance for maximum / ideal viewership you insured the show for rather than linger for years on great but not fantastic viewership.

  • mizzou_guy

    They died within 4 episodes of each other. This was done not long after RTD claimed that the source of TW’s success was its characters. You don’t just kill off what you and everyone else says is THE good thing about your show and expect it to continue on successfully without a good plan in mind, which they clearly didn’t have. All of those characters died solely just to create shock moments, and that’s a horrible reason to kill off any character on a show, let alone 60% of your cast.

  • Lois

    If Tourchwood comes back I hope they put back on BBC. Not everyone subscribes to Starz. A lot more people would watch it if it was back on BBC.